Creation vs evolution

G

GodlyLeetPerson

Guest
ok so if you trace through the bible from adam to jesus etc, there is a time line, but i forget what it is right now, and someone else who is more motivated will have to go look it up, but i think its something like 5thousand yrs.

now sientifically we know there was an ice age, wheres that mentioned in the bible?

since man was created in the begining, then man and dinosaur walked the earth together. why isnt there any proof of this?

since man and dino walked the earth together what killed off the dino?(if you say noah's flood ok ill buy it thats what killed the land based dinos, what about the sea creatures?)

since we can trace the biblical timeline to somewhere near 5thousand yrs.(someone please look this up, or count it on your fingers, and toes...) why can we carbon date fossils to be over 1million yrs old?

what came first the chicken or the egg?

and finally, Burger King, or McDonalds?
 
here's a link showing ancient artifacts supporting that man and dinosaur did co-exist

http://www.creationevidence.org/cemfram....an.html

This site believes dinoaurs were killed off int he flood

http://www.christiananswers.net/dinosaurs/j-extinct4.html

As for the water based dinos, was the flood water salty or fresh? I know some fish don't care but maybe the dinos couldn't adapt.

Carbon dating is inaccurate, it says live clams have been dead for thousands of years dude.

chicken came first biblically

McDonalds all the way!
 
Enough with the crappy molluscs, already. I've explained in another thread why Mollusc shells are susceptible to error - it's do with their syphon filter, incorporating sediment into the shell as it builds it, and therefore creating a false reading from the rock that the sediment was based on.

Most water based dino's were mammalian (kinda like the whales now) and therefore wouldn't have CARED about the salinity of the water. Laipluridons could care less about a flood - it was the biggest marine creature EVER, and was more capable of handling rising water levels than sinking ones.


Eon
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]I've explained in another thread why Mollusc shells are susceptible to error
Click to expand...

well if clams are susceptible to error, couldn't other things be, too?  *knows next-to-nothing about carbon dating and half lives and all that*  this probably isn't a real arguement, but if it's THAT much off on clams, what about everything else it's used on??

[edit! i forgot to answer the first post, silly me]
about the ice age thing...(disclaimer-this is speculation!) since the bible doesn't really say anything about what was happening outside the garden of eden while adam and eve were running around naming stuff, maybe the rest of the world froze while the garden was kept nice for adam and eve and the animals in it?? i'm sure eon'll rip this to shreds, lol, but maybe that happened? we really don't know how long they were in the garden before getting booted out, right...? anyway, i'll shutup so the smart people can post.

dunno about the chicken and the egg...

burger king all the way!  onion rings and whoppers for me!

hey...it's snowing here!
 
Chicken came first and Burger King. McDonald's is puke-worthy.
Also, we must realize this: the atmosphere of the pre-Flood was different. Before the Flood, rain had not come down. A mist came out of the ground over the earth, so said in Genesis 2 I think, maybe 3. Regardless: no rain. ANd it's surmised there was some canopy overhead, to block out the sun, giving the world a tropical paradise-y setting.
Well, perhaps the dinos weren't adapted for the new atmosphere and when coming out of the Ark, they sniff the fresh air and plop over dead.
That's a simplification, but probably what happened.
 
Tropics = 100% humidity and almost constant precipitation. So if there was ZERO precipitation Earth pre-flood must have been an arid desert.

Eon
 
Ahah. Notice what I mentioned about the mist that watered the earth? THe earth was more like a cool sauna than anything else, a hazy tropical area centered around where most people lived.
 
So.. Large seas with no evaporation / precipitation? ;)

Eon
 
.....I don't understand. Do you mean there were large seas at the time that didn't do anything?
God divided the water from the water into the seas and the firmament. So it was said in the times of the Scriptue. Do you know how long it took for us to figure out the atmosphere and the clouds are made of water and other chemicals? A long time. And God told them that, what, 5000 years ago? Geez.
There was no precipitation, correct, at the time. That came at the time of the Flood, when the floodgates of the world were opened up: rain came down at last from that massive buildup in the skies above them, in the form of rain, and the earth released its waters as well. Combined, that wiped out the world.
Whenever those clouds tore open, I think that it had a lot of evaporation built into it, but for some reason, had never poured down in the form of rain. God restrained it, I suppose. The seas were evaporating for sure, but never rained, so we had a lot of little seas, but no water, for a long time. Then it rained. ANd it rained hard.
 
And for what reason, might I ask, was God breaking the same physical laws he allegedly worked so hard to set up, and on such a massive scale too?

If there was indeed a creator of this everything-for-a-reason reality, to what end did he suspend one of its key mechanisms WHEN THE REALITY WAS ALREADY POPULATED??

Or was he planning to drown the creation anyway and had himself a little flush tank?..
 
So where did all the water evaporate from and to when the seas were set up? Just remember your physics - the water cycle says that just about ALL rain evaporated from the sea into the clouds and then falls to earth as precipitaiton (rain, snow, hail, sleet).

So if the Seas were there for years and years before the first rain, was the sea level constantly dropping? Where did all the water go? Did it just not evaporate?

Eon
 
.....what are you talking about Damar? Reality was populated with Adam at first, and already before him just a couple days, animals and plant life! Then Eve came along, then sin, then they had lotsa little kids, since incest was not really a crime back then.
As for breaking any physical laws....did he? DId he really break a law by storing up lots of rain before it fell? Because, as I recollect, water sometimes stores up for a long time in the rain clouds, and it takes forever to rain in the desert...and it rains in torrents in monsoons...
What physical law did he break in allowing water to store up for a big, big, big rain? ANd when the mists of the earth were shut off, all that moisture, all that water underneath the earth, stockpiled and stockpiled, until BOOM! On the same day the rains came down.
What physical law was broken, please, inform me. Or are you just going to sit in your chair and bash blindly, as I see a tendency for you to do?
Don't forget the watering mist Eon...I think that had a big part to do with it all. All that mist floated up and up and up...where did it go? Why, it started to circulate in the air, more and more, as more mist came....until, FWOOSH!
The seas were evaporating, but at a much slower rate than what they do today: for one they didn't have as much intensity of heat as we do now, because of that slight canopy thingie overhead...
 
What you posit would basically turn our planet into Venus. Runaway greenhouse effect from mist in the air, the planet doesn't disipate any of its stored heat.

You get a build of Carbon Monoxide - this combines with water and Sulphur from volcanic eruption, and you end up with an atmosphere that resembles aerosol Sulphuric acid.

Eon
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Ultima Avatar @ Feb. 10 2003,7:00)]BOOM! FWOOSH!
Click to expand...
LOOOVE your scientific terms, Ultima. This might be enough for your buddies in bible school, but I do suggest picking up a physics textbook sometime. Being the son of a nuclear physicist who had to sit through quite a few of his father's college lectures, I could write you out a whole lesson... but I won't, because apart from booms and whooshes you haven't given me a single coherent explanantion.

The whole idea of storing water vapor without letting it condense is ridiculous enough, but the little side effect mentioned by Eon makes it only that much less feasible...

Quit "homeskooling" and go to a real school boyee, it's good for you... and I don't mean Sunday school...
 
Okay then, Wise Guru. Tell me how the water was stored up and didn't fall? Tell me now. I'm also a son, but not the son of a nuclear physicist.
And, uh, for being the son of nuclear physicist..."WHEN THE REALITY WAS ALREADY POPULATED?" isn't that coherent.
So the fact of the humongous storms the monsoon brings, and the long periods of no rain in the deserts brings nothing to mind? Not even to post against, or is being your heritage automatically make you above answering my queries?
HEre: the planet wasn't truly heated in the same way you're thinking of. Try this: we have a canopy over our heads. How many times must I enforce this? THERE WAS A CANOPY. Something to protect us. THE SUN didn't really shine through that well. ITS RAYS bounced off THE CANOPY. THE CANOPY served as a shield from the SUN'S RAYS, so that we wouldn't be baked underneath our shield. Our life was just fine without the sun, and what is your next question?
 
Sorry, when you said canopy I was assuming that you were referring to a jungle canopy - ie heavy topgrowth leaves.

I didn't realise you were referring to a reflective shell that completely encased the whole globe, reflecting the Suns rays entirely so that none of the radiation (UV, Thermal or IR) could get to us.

How did the plants and animals survive? And if they DID survive, why didn't the whole planet collapse into heat death - because the heat couldn't escape. And if the heat COULD escape then I guess we really have to discover the secrets of this miraculous shield...

Eon
 
What Ultima is trying to beat into our brains, Eon, is that God, for some obscure reason, first built a fully self-regulated system of interdependent physical laws, then selectively suspended parts of it, then selectively restarted them. The domino effects that such actions imply make my head spin.

This makes God look like a very inept programmer. He first writes a few pages of code, compiles it, runs it, puts it into production and THEN starts hacking the live system. And the system was sure as hell live, minus the sentient life.

Makes no sense to me whatsoever, but then, God works in mysterious ways and Ultima loves it that way.

P.S. If God was a programmer working for me, and he operated according to the above MO, I'd fire him already.
 
OKay.....well, you have yet to answer how we survived, considering we had this cloud shield.
And, umm, I think I should clarify: I don't mean ALL of the sun was bounced off, that would plunge the world in pitch blackness. No thanks. We weren't a nocturnal world, even underneath the cloud canopy.
I guess I should have clarified that, too.
.....I'm stuck.....help someone.
Okay. Fine. You know what? Scratch the canopy. Let's take a different idea: God created the world. We had mist. We had evaporation. We had the sun. We could see space at night. We didn't have rain until a couple thousand years after creation. THEN it all came down in unpredicted and never again seen torrents.
There? Is that one better? If not, please point out my fallacies.
I am not by any means a biogenesis student. All I know is what I have slightly studied.
If NONE of my ideas work, but I think the canopy would..., then, assuming God created the world, what happened to creation?
 
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