You're not a true believer unless you can...

Well in the most controversial issue in my opinion would probably be creationism...since it's so important for christianity and at the same time for atheism.
 
That is probobly the easiest to get straight.... Life had to come from somewhere didnt it... the only Logical answer we have so far is God.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (ByblosHex @ Oct. 24 2004,10:09)]put up or shut up?

Sorry, I only speak English...

Ive done some pretty impossible things with God's help... Dancing is one, and I shurely coundt do that right now unless God allowed me. I cannot perform miracles on my own, but through my Faith they can be done.

Peter didnt walk on the water because he had webbed feet, he walked on the water because he had faith that he could...

If a mountain gets in my way, it will be removed one way or another.
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Put up or shut up means he wants you to prove your point rather than merely stating it. Otherwise don't state it at all.

God gave you the power of dancing ey? That seems a bit of a stretch to me.. Are you sure it wasn't just the added confidence consequent of the belief that god was helping you dance?
 
Well he cannot prove it wrong.. so hwy does he never shut up?

Confidence isnt my problem... I have an isue with silence in crowds and dancing has always been impssoible for me as I cannot even speak in those situations, but I prayed for that ability just for her, and God made it happen.
 
Hmm..I think it would be wise of you to consider all possibilities before concluding that god gave you the ability to dance.
 
Yeah, haven't you ever seen Footloose?

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Life had to come from somewhere didnt it... the only Logical answer we have so far is God.
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That is an erroneous statement built upon the lack of knowledge concerning the definition of "logical".

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Well he cannot prove it wrong.. so hwy does he never shut up?
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If you understood logic you would know it is impossible to prove a fallacy.
 
When it comes down to it, what came first, i would think most here would agree that there had to be a Great Cuase at the begining, but for every cause there is an effect,

IE
Big Bang

Universe now

But what caused the Big bang? would not something indepentant of the cause, have to have started the first cause.

Basics behind intelligant design, which seems to be fitting with more and more scienists now than naturalism, just most school systems dont want to admit it.

No itelligent design does not name the intelligence it leaves that to religions, just states that there has to be an independant cause for the Big bang to have happened.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]would not something indepentant of the cause, have to have started the first cause
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That's not a valid logical statement for someone that believes God had no first cause or creator.

That is also the problem with the Argument To Design, ie, The Watchmaker Analogy.
 
Of course there has to be an original 'uncaused cause,' but this does not have to be god. At least not in the sense that 'he' is known as today.
 
there comes a point though when you have to agree that there is something outside our understanding otherwise we can just keep asking what caused that and never have a starting point. which is the "problem" with naturalism

EDIT

Yes MR.Bill and that is the point of Intelligent design.
 
D.V., I have been pondering some of the things you said yesterday...

For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light. Matthew 11:30

Considering this, I cannot bring myself to believe that a mustard seed is a difficult thing to come by. He never seems to ask much of us, wanting us to have faith to trust and depend on Him. I can think of instances that I am thankful that He answered "no," and this answer, along with, "wait," admittedly feel as if I am being ignored by Him at times. I simply have faith that Romans 8:28 is in effect and He has my best interest on His heart. I can't imagine the feeling that no prayer has ever been answered, more especially in the affirmative! My heart mourns for you in that.

Delight thyself also in the LORD; and he shall give thee the desires of thine heart. Psalm 37:4
This verse carries a condition. I have also heard Bill Gothard say that when our hearts desire to be lined up with God, He lines our desires to His.

Concerning the verses in the OP, I have looked them up in these commentaries. Matthew Henry has a lengthy one, but they all seem to line up. Your opinion?
http://eword.gospelcom.net/comments/
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Have I become that predictable?
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I'll say it anyway.

If that is the case, then why can't you do the miraculous in the name of God? Heal the sick, move mountains, etc?

And if the answer is "because we shouldn't test God", then why have divine gifts at all? When CAN you use them?
 
I read the commentary on Mark 16. And well, it was just a commentary
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He didn't actually answer anything that we've discussed here, so I didn't feel it was worth mentioning. He didn't explain if the gifts were just for the Apostles or for every believer. Nor does he explain the later addition of verses in the chapter.

Sorry.
 
not a problem
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I am wondering if I Corinthians 12 may sheds some light in explaing the verses in the opening post. vs. 10 mentions discerning of spirits, not necessarily casting them out...surely you would not have one without the other. Paul had that serpent incident...and I am still very curious why drinking anything deadly would come into play. Was He speaking simply for protection, or what was really going on in that day making it necessary for that to be said?
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Dark Virtue @ Sep. 09 2004,9:18)]1. Cast out devils
2. Speak with new tongues
3. Take up serpents
4. Drink deadly things
5. Heal the sick by the laying on of hands

Mark 16:16  Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. 17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues; 18 they will pick up snakes with their hands; and when they drink deadly poison, it will not hurt them at all; they will place their hands on sick people, and they will get well."

Would someone please comment on why these signs don't exist today?  Well, unless you're Benny Hinn
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Bonus points if you discuss the theory behind the questioned addition of everything after Mark 16:8.
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the verse is:

14Later Jesus appeared to the Eleven as they were eating; he rebuked them for their lack of faith and their stubborn refusal to believe those who had seen him after he had risen.
15He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the good news to all creation.

16Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. 17And these signs will accompany those who believe:

In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues; 18they will pick up snakes with their hands; and when they drink deadly poison, it will not hurt them at all; they will place their hands on sick people, and they will get well."
19After the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, he was taken up into heaven and he sat at the right hand of God. 20Then the disciples went out and preached everywhere, and the Lord worked with them and confirmed his word by the signs that accompanied it.


There have been People documented who have done these things. Infact there are the snake handlers in Tennessee. Sure a few have died drinking strychnine. BUT MANY HAVE NOT. Why? I could not say.

I know people who have seen the dead raised. I myself have been healed from pain and illness instantly after prayer. (I have experience this personally) I have not cast out demons but I constantly prayer against demonic attacks. And have seen the results of those prayers opposed to when I do not pray. I do like snakes, but if God told me to drink strychnine I would. I would never suggest it or do so without release from God.

Can we do these thing . YOU BETCHA! Why can’t others simple”


Prophet Without Honor MATT 13

53When Jesus had finished these parables, he moved on from there. 54Coming to his hometown, he began teaching the people in their synagogue, and they were amazed. "Where did this man get this wisdom and these miraculous powers?" they asked. 55"Isn't this the carpenter's son? Isn't his mother's name Mary, and aren't his brothers James, Joseph, Simon and Judas? 56Aren't all his sisters with us? Where then did this man get all these things?" 57And they took offense at him.
But Jesus said to them, "Only in his hometown and in his own house is a prophet without honor."
58And he did not do many miracles there because of their lack of faith.


So we can debated and point out our opinions. I once stand by Faith. Its all about faith
 
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