Sort of blows your mind, doesn't it? Mine too. Welcome to the limits of human comprehension. Unfortunately we can't live out here, but it's nice to vacation.Dark Virtue said:You said that with such ease, but do you even have an inkling of what that means? How is it possible to exist outside of time?
Anyway, yes, I have an inkling of what that means. My conclusion requires 2 assumptions, at least one of which is not true in your case.
Assumption 1: God exists and is infinite.
Assumption 2: All dimensions are finite.
I haven't heard arguments for or against the finitude of dimensions, but I assume that at the very least, space is finite, because matter is finite. In other words, we couldn't have an infinitely large object in our spatial universe because we have a finite amount of matter to make up all objects. It's not proof, but it's inductive evidence.
So what follows from these assumptions are that God cannot exist solely within our dimensions, because although finite dimensions can sometimes hold infinite processes (such as convergent infinite series-- for instance, when you drop a bouncing ball), they cannot hold infinite entities. God must be dimensionless.
This also holds true using the ontological definition of God (which I happen to find rather cheesy): God is that which nothing greater than it can be conceived. Well, which is greater: a being described in finite dimensions, or a dimensionless one? Obviously, a dimensionless one.
So God is dimensionless. We cannot comprehend this, but we can make an analogy to something we *slightly* comprehend: this means that God is like dividing by zero. While the technical mathematical definition of division by zero is "undefined," in informal mathematical proof, such as in taking the limits of expressions, we say that dividing by zero yields infinity. We will never be able to divide by zero, so we will never know what it yields. But if you look at a graph with a vertical asymptote, it's pretty clear where it's going.
Back to the original question: How is it possible to exist outside of time?
Time is just a dimension, just as the three dimensions of space. If you're a materialist/naturalist, asking how it is possible to exist outside of time is just like asking how it is possible to exist outside of space. Well, a substantial amount, if not most, modern physicists aren't materialists/naturalists anymore. Take from that anything you like.
You're using time again: it's not correct to say that God created Satan knowing everything that Satan WOULD do, but that God created all parts of Satan "simultaneously". God created all moments of Satan's existence over time, all "at once". Again, the quotes are because there is no fully apt way of describing events in human language without implying time, but that doesn't mean God is bound by time, it just means that we cannot describe God without implying that He is. This is our limitation, not God's.Let's break this down a bit farther and specify that God knew EVERYTHING that Satan would do, the fall of man, everything. And yet, he STILL created him. Therefore, God had a REASON for creating him. God INTENDED for Man to fall and he INTENDED Satan to do his, GOD'S, dirty work. Like hiring a hit man so you don't get your hands dirty and you have someone else to blame.
Does God really have a reason for creating Satan? I have no idea. But it isn't really fair to cry "Hit Man." Why did God make any of us? I have no idea. I mentioned my personal thoughts on the issue in this post, however. I basically maintain that God created as art.
I'm sorry if I'm sounding really, really nutty right now. I can weird people out sometimes. If I am completely not making sense and you think I've lost my mind or smoked something illegal, just know that what I'm trying to say makes perfect sense to me and possibly nobody else. My uncle, the youth pastor, told me once, "I have a few friends who live 'in the deep end,' but you... you live under the deep end." That's basically what philosophy proves, in the end. We can't make sense of everything.
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