I whole heartedly agree A-town. I have tattoos and I am a youth pastor...I don't water down my messages or buy into emergent propaganda, I am what some people would consider a tough guy because I ride a motorcycle to work and used to work in a coal mine to pay for seminary. It's not our appearance, but out hearts that makes us different.
emo and Christianity.
- Thread starter |CoR|Braveheart
- Start date
the_great_eskimo_pie
Former Official Thread Killer
Actually... I have to disagree with everyone who said its our appearance really does not make a difference. Most of this is personal beliefs, some of which I have struggled with for a long time. So please no flaming me. 
Appearance is important. How one looks, acts is perceived by the world affects one's witness. I have one question for those who dress Emo, grunge or whatever. How many people have come to know Christ because you dress exactly like them? What sets you apart? how can they know by looking at you that you are different?
Am I saying I have a problem with the way they dress? no, However, they should be careful when they choose what they want to wear and how they dress. Let me give you an example as to why:
Say you are an unsaved person driving down the road and a car passes you with an Icathus (The fish symbol) On the back of their car. That same car proceeds to cut you off in traffic. Would you really want to listen to that person's witness? No, they act in exactly the same manner as those who are not saved.
This was hypothetical, however it is really true. I have met people who were in the above situation and were very unreceptive to the gospel because of it.
Dressing in clothing that does not edify the Lord is wrong. I got rid of some T-shirts and such that I owned that did not have edifying remarks on them. How serious is someone going to take me if I walk around wearing a shirt that says "I'm with Stupid?" We live in a society where you are judged based on how you dress. I'm not saying that Christians need to walk around in suits and ties all the time, however we do need to take better care as to what we wear and how we are perceived. We need to stand out from the crowd. That is the point of being in the world, but not of it.
Tattoos... Well, Tattoos are something that is between you and God. I don't have a problem with them so long as they are "clean" (No nude women or profanity or anything dealing with witchcraft and the like...) So you had tattoos before you got saved, well what you do with them is between you and God. I have seen some tattoos that were really awesome and some that made me want to retch.
Atown, Your note on gaming was really good.
We do play all those games and do all that stuff. The only question we have to ask ourselves about gaming is... (Yes I struggle with this one a lot) If Jesus were here, would He want to play this game with me?
Alright, I held your attention (I hope I held your attention anyway) for far too long. Let me get off my soap box.
Appearance is important. How one looks, acts is perceived by the world affects one's witness. I have one question for those who dress Emo, grunge or whatever. How many people have come to know Christ because you dress exactly like them? What sets you apart? how can they know by looking at you that you are different?
Am I saying I have a problem with the way they dress? no, However, they should be careful when they choose what they want to wear and how they dress. Let me give you an example as to why:
Say you are an unsaved person driving down the road and a car passes you with an Icathus (The fish symbol) On the back of their car. That same car proceeds to cut you off in traffic. Would you really want to listen to that person's witness? No, they act in exactly the same manner as those who are not saved.
This was hypothetical, however it is really true. I have met people who were in the above situation and were very unreceptive to the gospel because of it.
Dressing in clothing that does not edify the Lord is wrong. I got rid of some T-shirts and such that I owned that did not have edifying remarks on them. How serious is someone going to take me if I walk around wearing a shirt that says "I'm with Stupid?" We live in a society where you are judged based on how you dress. I'm not saying that Christians need to walk around in suits and ties all the time, however we do need to take better care as to what we wear and how we are perceived. We need to stand out from the crowd. That is the point of being in the world, but not of it.
Tattoos... Well, Tattoos are something that is between you and God. I don't have a problem with them so long as they are "clean" (No nude women or profanity or anything dealing with witchcraft and the like...) So you had tattoos before you got saved, well what you do with them is between you and God. I have seen some tattoos that were really awesome and some that made me want to retch.
Atown, Your note on gaming was really good.
We do play all those games and do all that stuff. The only question we have to ask ourselves about gaming is... (Yes I struggle with this one a lot) If Jesus were here, would He want to play this game with me?Alright, I held your attention (I hope I held your attention anyway) for far too long. Let me get off my soap box.
Durruck
Pirate!
But consider this: Why do programs like Alcoholics Anonymous and Narcotics Anonymous work? Because everyone in the room feels comfortable talking about what's going on. They know coming in that everyone else there, usually even the moderator, has struggled or is struggling with the same problem. Would you refused to believe someone is a Christian just because you know they were at an AA/NA meeting? Absolutely not!
Now take that thought and apply it to other situations. I think it would be just as bad to claim someone can't be a Christian just because they drive a blue car... live in a brown house, let their grass grow a little long before mowing, didn't bother to weed the flowerbed this week, because they were out looking at motorcycles on the way home from the tattoo parlor.
The original topic was about music styles and dress. I happen to really like the emo, hard rock music - but I generally listen to Christian bands that sing praise or truth in their songs (if it weren't for them, I'd be listening to similar secular music). I don't dress emo or wear a wallet chain or flashy belt or slashed shirts, but it's because I'm too lazy. It would be just as easy to say that country music and rap is useless in the church, and cowboy boots are instruments of the devil. Obviously, the statement holds no truth at all.
In fact, I know several times I've been able to get into conversations that planted seeds or got some heart-to-heart time and was able to share the gospel with people because of who I am and where I've been. I'm sure that the emo, the goth, the tattooed motorcycle rider, the lawyer, the janitor... they can all reach someone that the rest of us can't. You don't have to be my twin to be my brother in Christ.
We have to be careful that we're not labeling, stereotyping, or judging. That's not our place. God alone reserves the authority to judge our thoughts, words, and actions.
Now take that thought and apply it to other situations. I think it would be just as bad to claim someone can't be a Christian just because they drive a blue car... live in a brown house, let their grass grow a little long before mowing, didn't bother to weed the flowerbed this week, because they were out looking at motorcycles on the way home from the tattoo parlor.
The original topic was about music styles and dress. I happen to really like the emo, hard rock music - but I generally listen to Christian bands that sing praise or truth in their songs (if it weren't for them, I'd be listening to similar secular music). I don't dress emo or wear a wallet chain or flashy belt or slashed shirts, but it's because I'm too lazy. It would be just as easy to say that country music and rap is useless in the church, and cowboy boots are instruments of the devil. Obviously, the statement holds no truth at all.
In fact, I know several times I've been able to get into conversations that planted seeds or got some heart-to-heart time and was able to share the gospel with people because of who I am and where I've been. I'm sure that the emo, the goth, the tattooed motorcycle rider, the lawyer, the janitor... they can all reach someone that the rest of us can't. You don't have to be my twin to be my brother in Christ.
We have to be careful that we're not labeling, stereotyping, or judging. That's not our place. God alone reserves the authority to judge our thoughts, words, and actions.
blackgravity
New Member
Dressing a certain way has a lot to do with how people receive you, but as Christians, it's really not our place to judge anyone by how they dress. Judgment is judgment, no matter for what reason. I think it's a positive thing for someone to say "hey that guy is more like me than I thought".
Just because I (had) long hair and prefer to wear clothes that a comfortable to me, didn't make me emo either. I'm not gonna go out in rags because of how it reflects on my family, but if I have to run to the store for diapers, I'm not too worried about how I look or how it makes others perceive me.
I don't really understand what the criteria would be for inappropriate dress anyway. A bunch of guys standing around in jeans and tshirts doesn't exactly strike me as threatening in any way.
Just because I (had) long hair and prefer to wear clothes that a comfortable to me, didn't make me emo either. I'm not gonna go out in rags because of how it reflects on my family, but if I have to run to the store for diapers, I'm not too worried about how I look or how it makes others perceive me.
I don't really understand what the criteria would be for inappropriate dress anyway. A bunch of guys standing around in jeans and tshirts doesn't exactly strike me as threatening in any way.
the_great_eskimo_pie
Former Official Thread Killer
Gentlemen, you miss my point. Did I ever say that Christians are to judge? No. I said that Christians ARE Judged by how we dress and behave. Everything we do shows the world who we are and what we stand for.
blackgravity
New Member
I was referring more to what Braveheart said. Yes, we are judged by how others perceive us. By my style of dress is in no way connected to my behavior. I think that stereotype is kinda flying out the window, as it should. It's just disrespectful IMO.
Durruck
Pirate!
I may have already told this story. I'm not sure, but I'm not going to go back and review countless posts across multiple forums. It's relevant here & now...so here it is (again?)
It's been a while now - maybe last summer or the summer before. The exact date & time don't really matter though. I was at work (I'm a firefighter/paramedic) and was coming back from the hospital in the medic. I was channel-surfing on the radio and landed it on RadioU (www.radiou.com) - a local Christian rock/rap/emo/electric/hardcore station. The first few songs were modern rock, similar to what you'd hear on other top40 stations. Now keep in mind that Tim is also a Christian, but lives far enough away that he can't get RadioU at home. He can pick up another Christian station which is much, much lighter. But I digress.
After the few songs, a hardrock/deathmetal song comes on. Full out screaming, double-bass pedal-thumping, heart-racing goodness. Tim made a sour face and said something along the lines of "I don't even understand why they make Christian music like this."
Ouch.
So I asked - how do you reach the lost that like this music if you don't make it for them? How do you show them that God can cross any boundary? How do you show them that God isn't all about wearing a suit on Sunday morning? How can you show them it doesn't have to come from your Hymnal to be praise and worship?
Remember David's response after his robe came open while he was dancing in praise to the Lord?
Notice that David was being criticized for the way that he worshiped too! But I think that David takes the right approach - he will worship the Lord no matter what anyone else thinks. If it's pleasing to God, why do we care what others think?
I may look weird if I raise my hands in worship. I may sound off-pitch when I sing. I may not wear a suit & tie on Sunday. But I don't care. I don't care if you judge me. I don't care if an outsider judges me. I'm not afraid to be the one that makes the poor college kid feel comfortable when he comes to worship in his ratty clothes - the best he can do. I'm not afraid to be the one that lets the goth/punk/ska/emo/rap/hardcore/electric listener know that there can be a positive message without losing the style of music she loves.
Someday when my guitar-playing and singing aren't horrible, I'll show people that it doesn't matter what style of music you love, or what clothes you wear, or how long your hair is... that God loves us all, regardless of what the naysayers and critics think.
It's been a while now - maybe last summer or the summer before. The exact date & time don't really matter though. I was at work (I'm a firefighter/paramedic) and was coming back from the hospital in the medic. I was channel-surfing on the radio and landed it on RadioU (www.radiou.com) - a local Christian rock/rap/emo/electric/hardcore station. The first few songs were modern rock, similar to what you'd hear on other top40 stations. Now keep in mind that Tim is also a Christian, but lives far enough away that he can't get RadioU at home. He can pick up another Christian station which is much, much lighter. But I digress.
After the few songs, a hardrock/deathmetal song comes on. Full out screaming, double-bass pedal-thumping, heart-racing goodness. Tim made a sour face and said something along the lines of "I don't even understand why they make Christian music like this."
Ouch.
So I asked - how do you reach the lost that like this music if you don't make it for them? How do you show them that God can cross any boundary? How do you show them that God isn't all about wearing a suit on Sunday morning? How can you show them it doesn't have to come from your Hymnal to be praise and worship?
Remember David's response after his robe came open while he was dancing in praise to the Lord?
2 Samuel 6:16 said:
Notice that David was being criticized for the way that he worshiped too! But I think that David takes the right approach - he will worship the Lord no matter what anyone else thinks. If it's pleasing to God, why do we care what others think?
I may look weird if I raise my hands in worship. I may sound off-pitch when I sing. I may not wear a suit & tie on Sunday. But I don't care. I don't care if you judge me. I don't care if an outsider judges me. I'm not afraid to be the one that makes the poor college kid feel comfortable when he comes to worship in his ratty clothes - the best he can do. I'm not afraid to be the one that lets the goth/punk/ska/emo/rap/hardcore/electric listener know that there can be a positive message without losing the style of music she loves.
Someday when my guitar-playing and singing aren't horrible, I'll show people that it doesn't matter what style of music you love, or what clothes you wear, or how long your hair is... that God loves us all, regardless of what the naysayers and critics think.
inkelis
New Member
I second your post Durruck, i think you got it right on!