Obama elected President

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Cløud said:
I am sorry for what I said I admit I got a little too passionate about it but heres my proof.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/.sh...categorized/2008/06/13/bobirthcertificate.jpg

fakezt4.png


^Taken directly from the birth certificate on his site. Its located on the lower center portion of it. Simply zoom in cut it out and flip it vertical you can see the printer mark 2007. This is the same picture on factcheck and snope and obamas site so I have no doubt.
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It is a copy, note the message at the bottom.
 
I think it being a copy will serve only to feed those who say that the original is conveniently missing.
 
Alizak said:
You just have to learn to deal with what you got and try to make the best of it. Most of all we need to pray...
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While I agree that we need to pray for our leaders, the sentiment of "deal with what you got" is not consistent with the philosophies that guided the men and women who established our nation.

All citizens of the United States have the means to make a limited impact on local, state, and federal government. Voting is only one of the tools all citizens possess. Others posting in this thread recommended writing to your Congressmen to express your opinion; that is another tool at our disposal.

Americans are largely content to "deal with what we got" instead of voting in all elections (not just presidential elections), researching issues and candidates before voting, and voicing their concerns to their elected representatives.

We should respect those in authority over us. We should pray for those in authority over us. We should render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s; that is, we should pay our taxes.

But we should not settle for merely tolerating what our local, state, and federal government do.

We should get involved.

Again, to quote Ronald Reagan:
Our Constitution is a document in which "We the people" tell the government what it is allowed to do.
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Didn't you the people tell the government what you are allowing them to do by voting in certain people based on their policies, position on issues and promises? Is that not the purpose of voting?
 
Tek7 said:
While I agree that we need to pray for our leaders, the sentiment of "deal with what you got" is not consistent with the philosophies that guided the men and women who established our nation....
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I don't think Alizak is trying to say "this is what happened, so get over it" but instead he is saying "this is what the majority of American voters wanted, and thus Obama won the presidency" and that is all.

Also, Tek the "deal with what you got" mentality cannot be applied in this election as 57 million people voted for McCain, but 65 million people voted for Obama. That's a difference of 8 million people. Also the fact that Obama got 364 electoral votes. We must realize that not everyone is upset with the results.

If everyone was upset that Obama won then "deal with what you got" would have an entirely different meaning.
 
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Goblit said:
Didn't you the people tell the government what you are allowing them to do by voting in certain people based on their policies, position on issues and promises? Is that not the purpose of voting?
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It is. Voting is an important tool citizens can use to make an impact on government, but it is not the only thing. I agree that a form of democracy is the best system of government because it helps ensure that the people have at least limited control over who is allowed to lead a country.

I disagree with Obama's platform on nearly every issue, but I value and believe in the system that allowed Americans to choose their next President. I do not place my faith in government, but I believe the United States of America's form of government is one of the best, if not the best, in the world.
Odale said:
I don't think Alizak is trying to say "this is what happened, so get over it" but instead he is saying "this is what the majority of American voters wanted, and thus Obama won the presidency, and that is all".
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That doesn't mean Christians should simply stand by and watch as Obama pushes anti-Christian values, such as a pro-abortion plan:
When South Dakota passed a law banning all abortions in a direct effort to have Roe overruled, I was the only candidate for President to raise money to help the citizens of South Dakota repeal that law. When anti-choice protesters blocked the opening of an Illinois Planned Parenthood clinic in a community where affordable health care is in short supply, I was the only candidate for President who spoke out against it. And I will continue to defend this right by passing the Freedom of Choice Act as president.
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Source: Obama Statement on 35th Anniversary of Roe v. Wade Decision
Abortion advocates who want FOCA [Freedom of Choice Act] concur: NOW, NARAL, Planned Parenthood, and FOCA sponsor Senator Barbara Boxer all contend that FOCA will strike down all state pro-life laws.

The shockwaves that FOCA would cause are immense and wide-ranging, but recent research shows one effect in particular. Certain state laws that are doomed under FOCA actually prevent a statistically significant number of abortions. These laws include parental involvement requirements, informed consent laws, and restrictions on government funding of abortions.
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Source: Barack Obama's "Freedom of Choice Act" Would Mean 125K More Abortions

I did not mean my reply to sound hostile toward Alizak; I apologize if it came across that way. I only meant to remind the American citizens on our forums that they have limited means by which to affect government and they should use those means in according with Biblical principles.

You'll notice that I am not suggesting we "grab the pitchforks and torches" and march on the White House come January 20. That would invalidate the system which results in positive changes in government as well as negative changes. I am suggesting Christians use respectful, civil means such as informed voting and letter writing to make changes. I am encouraging Christians to work within the laws and guidelines of the system, not rebel against it.

I am not writing this from a position of anger, but rather of love and concern for country. I want the city, state, and country where I live to prosper. I want to see my local, state, and federal governments pass laws aligned with Biblical principles.

The government of the United States of America, steered by and comprised of its citizens, has accomplished great things; it has protected its people in times of war and peace and reached out to other nations in those countries' times of need. I am familiar with America's missteps as well as its acts of charity and still love my country. I do not want to see my country move away from the principles that made it great.

If my tone was tinged with frustration, it was not with Alizak, but rather with Christians who voice their displeasure with trends in government while, at the same time, refusing to get involved. I wanted to emphasize that Americans are not without the tools to make positive changes when elected officials and candidates say and do things with which we disagree.
Odale said:
Also, Tek the "deal with what you got" mentality cannot be applied in this election because sure 57 something million people voted for McCain, but just under 65.5 million people voted for Obama. Not everyone is upset with the results.
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True. But as a Christian who believes birth begins at conception, I can not help but be upset with the results.

That does not mean I do not respect the President-Elect. I will pray for him. If God can change the heart of Paul, a religious man who once actively sought to murder first-century Christians and later spread the Gospel to several countries and wrote several books of the New Testament, then no one is beyond God's reach except the man or woman who will refuse Him. (God will not violate free will.)

We, as Christians are charged to pray for our leaders, and I will pray for the President, whether I agree with his platform or not.
 
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um.....why does it say you quoted me when it wasn't something I said Tek? (last quote in about post) .....or has senility hit and I not remember saying it?
 
Goblit said:
um.....why does it say you quoted me when it wasn't something I said Tek? (last quote in about post) .....or has senility hit and I not remember saying it?
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My mistake. I copied and pasted the QUOTE tag from your post rather than from Odale's post.

It's fixed now. Sorry about that.
 
Goblit said:
Didn't you the people tell the government what you are allowing them to do by voting in certain people based on their policies, position on issues and promises? Is that not the purpose of voting?
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The problem is the average American lacks critical thinking. They follow blind impulses to words like change. They do not read or research further into what exactly is this change. They sit and let the whimsical words reach them from there couches as they watch TV.

So until you wake everyone up you will end up with corrupt leaders out of the machines.
 
change is not improvement...obama is going to socialize this nation...it's the same as burning the constitution the rest of the way..the constitution has changed(by now being ash) but it has not improved.
 
Cløud said:
The problem is the average American lacks critical thinking. They follow blind impulses to words like change. They do not read or research further into what exactly is this change. They sit and let the whimsical words reach them from there couches as they watch TV.

So until you wake everyone up you will end up with corrupt leaders out of the machines.
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"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter." -Winston Churchill.
 
of course its a Constitutional Republic, But the idea's still the same. The good majority of voters don't have any idea about where their candidates stand on the issues or how those issues will affect them.
 
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Cløud said:
Barack Obama is not the president of the United States and he never will be.

I laugh at all of you who voted for and support someone who is constitutionaly ineligible to be president.

here is the Case in the Us supreme court. http://origin.www.supremecourtus.gov/docket/08-570.htm

Barack has till Dec. 1st to provide a valid birth certificate other wise he is at the mercy of the court.

The Birth Certificate on his site is fake and when he went to indonesia to go to school his father had to claim him because Indonesia wasn't accepting duel citizenship in a time of war. Which means he voided his US citizenship if it even existed in the first place. Also there is testimony from his kenyan grandmother saying she witnessed Obama's birth in Kenya. His step sister said she witnesses baracks birth at one Hawaiin hospital while barack said he was born at the other lol.

Barack has not provided any documentation since the case has been filed in late august. The DNC has failed all US citizens in providing a candidate eligible to be president. The DNC also filed a joint commission to dismissal, meaning they are siding with Obama and not asking um hey where are these records so we can shoot this down.

My question to Barack is if you are a natural born citizen prove it!!!!

listen to http://www.patriotbrigaderadio.com/livejava.php for more info at night they have had Phil Berg on 3 times this week to discuss it.
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he will be president until proved otherwise..i'm honestly expecting this to get swept under the rug and never be exposed.

vibrokatana said:
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcertificate.asp


http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/does_barack_obama_have_kenyan_citizenship.html
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/citizen.asp

to a lesser degree:
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/corsis_dull_hatchet.html



Can we please be respectful here? Nobody asked for your opinions of what they voted for. That really came off as arrogant and staunchy to me. And I don't even openly support Obama.
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vibro..please follow your own advice. your reply right above is also quite harsh.

Goblit said:
Didn't you the people tell the government what you are allowing them to do by voting in certain people based on their policies, position on issues and promises? Is that not the purpose of voting?
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yes..but i did not vote for obama..therefore I ahve a reason to be upset..however it's now time to buckle down and get ready for one rough ride. Me and gen are heading out this weekend to try out some weapons and then buy some before inauguration day.

Elader Arkon said:
of course its a Constitutional Republic, But the idea's still the same. The good majority of voters don't have any idea about where their candidates stand on the issues or how those issues will affect them.
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so true

Moderator's note: Four posts merged. Again. >_< Please use the Multi-Quote button next time.
 
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"In these sentiments, Sir, I agree to this Constitution, with all its faults, — if they are such; because I think a general Government necessary for us, and there is no form of government but what may be a blessing to the people, if well administered; and I believe, farther, that this is likely to be well administered for a course of years, and can only end in despotism, as other forms have done before it, when the people shall become so corrupted as to need despotic government, being incapable of any other."

~Benjamin Franklin
(1787-06-28)
 
Remember a while ago when I posted in some topic, "this is the worst thread"? Well, I was serious then, but I have changed my mind.

THIS.

is the worst thread.
 
Hardly. This an open, honest discussion about the effects of the outcome of the election. While by it's very nature, such a thread can quickly devolve into name-calling... I'm impressed at how level the tone has been (I'm not innocent by a long shot - I appreciate you all just ignoring me when I get fired up)
 
Bonk!Ow! said:
Remember a while ago when I posted in some topic, "this is the worst thread"? Well, I was serious then, but I have changed my mind.

THIS.

is the worst thread.
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Infraction issued for inflammatory post.

Durruck said:
Hardly. This an open, honest discussion about the effects of the outcome of the election.
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Agreed.
 
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