Why can't we?

Eon said:
True - but it's much harder for a school teacher to do that, because history, science, language and so forth have much more commonly accepted rules.
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But just because a rule is commonly accepted doesn't make it correct. Slavery was commonly accepted for many years, but that doesn't justify the act. Pastors and preachers are men (or women) and are not infallable, just like the rest of us. A preacher isn't the Lord Himself, all he is does is act as a vessel to pass on information. That delivery inevitably is influenced by each individual's personality and bias.

Regarding this forum, I would like to become more active here. At times, though, I find it hard for discussions to continue when both sides have no reasonable consideration of ever changing their viewpoints.
 
hescominsoon said:
Why would a Christian ever change their viewpoint? If they did that..they undermine the very faith they say they support.
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Of course they wouldn't. But that is precisely my point. Why do we as Christians automatically expect all debate to end in someone of a different belief changing their minds and accepting ours? And likewise, anyone here debating and discussing who is expecting us to prove God to them is never going to have that result. We can't prove our beliefs when 90% of them are based on faith. That is the only reason I have mixed feelings about these forums. Not that what is going on here is wrong. It's interesting discussion. I just question what the expectation is.
 
I think you're missing my point. The discussion that goes on here with Dark Virtue and other non-believers is not witnessing. It's defense of our faith. DV is not here with an open heart and mind wanting to learn about God. From what I read, he is asking us to answer questions and things he doesn't understand about why Christians belive the way that they do. My point is, you cannot witness to someone who is not yet open to receiving the Lord. First comes God softening a person's heart. So as I said, what goes on here is mostly Christians explaining themselves, not witnessing.

(This is just my observation. I know that I am probably not 100% correct, but this is how I perceive things.)
 
From what I have seen over the past year is debate (Yes) but the witnessing comes in how we debate and discuss the topics. How an argument is presented is as important as what is said
 
Hmmmm my take on a bit of this now that I've thought about it and read more responses, who says that we are not the vessel that helps God soften hearts???? Did you ever think that maybe because we are honest and frank and unwavering that just maybe that example and witness would give God that small opening to touch non-believers hearts???? From personal experiences plus my own personal feelings on much of this, I rarely take the time or effort to discuss here because I know God has made others that can do that easier then I can. My heart is just too sensitive and gets hurt easily. That does not mean I don't pray and advise more in private settings which is a better mix for me. Just because someone doesn't believe, does not mean we do not pray for them. Blessings,"Angel"
 
Gen I was wondering what you had in mind exactly as you posed your original question.

The Bible promises us that the Word of God will not come back void and that is one of the reasoning for witnessing or defending our faith. The Word will go where God pleases, we are simply called to be the messengers. I see all questions and debates as good springing boards, like unto a good Preacher who preaches a good sermon. It causes us to study to show ourselves approved unto God, a workman who needeth not be ashamed.

A friend once told me that every step leads us closer to God. True because we will all stand before the Judgement Seat of Christ, but much more than that because God woos us to Himself. If non-believers are here, it can be a step in the right direction! I oftentimes wonder how many non-believers may come to see what we have to say without ever saying a word.
 
Posts from DV and the other non-believers allows me to sharpen my knowledge of the Bible in ways that normal reading/meditating/Bible studies does not, which is why I like to come here and read what they have to say. To me, it is a good test of my faith and helps me to strengthen it.
 
Well, I was educated in a British Public School - although I suspect that the term means something different to your definition of a public school.

I suppose I haven't much experience of what a comprehensive / grammer school makes of the syllabus, but one thing is sure. Much of education is based around facts, and no matter what religion the teacher adheres to, 1 + 1 = 2.

The two definitions of Abraham Lincoln ARE valid. On the one hand he signed a documen that promised "Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness" for all men but on the other he was a slave owner. What are you SUPPOSED to think?
 
I really did not have anything in mind. It was just a nagging observation that I was curious about. It has been interesting to see the responses.

Gen
 
Eon said:
Well, I was educated in a British Public School - although I suspect that the term means something different to your definition of a public school.

I suppose I haven't much experience of what a comprehensive / grammer school makes of the syllabus, but one thing is sure. Much of education is based around facts, and no matter what religion the teacher adheres to, 1 + 1 = 2.

The two definitions of Abraham Lincoln ARE valid. On the one hand he signed a documen that promised "Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness" for all men but on the other he was a slave owner. What are you SUPPOSED to think?
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lol...Since you are not an American I will forgive you for confusing George Washington with Abraham Lincoln :)
 
Argh. I did at that, colour me pink with embarassment.

On the other hand, whilst he might have been honest, I imagine you consider him to be gravely mistaken in matters of faith?
 
Genesis1315 said:
I really did not have anything in mind. It was just a nagging observation that I was curious about. It has been interesting to see the responses.

Gen
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I was curious. I love good preaching and I was thinking at about the same time you started this thread how nice it would be if we could get members to post outlines or a brief synopsis of the sermons they hear throughout the week. I really can't get enough. When the preacher teases and says his sermon will last all night, in my heart of hearts I only wish it were so!
 
Mr_Slice said:
I think you're missing my point. The discussion that goes on here with Dark Virtue and other non-believers is not witnessing. It's defense of our faith. DV is not here with an open heart and mind wanting to learn about God. From what I read, he is asking us to answer questions and things he doesn't understand about why Christians belive the way that they do. My point is, you cannot witness to someone who is not yet open to receiving the Lord. First comes God softening a person's heart. So as I said, what goes on here is mostly Christians explaining themselves, not witnessing.

(This is just my observation. I know that I am probably not 100% correct, but this is how I perceive things.)
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You're not quite correct.

I am not, as you said, here with an open heart. I am here, however, with an open MIND. Remember all that talk about logic, reason, proof, etc? You can't judge that with your heart.

If you give me proof and evidence then I don't need to a soft heart open to suggestion. Facts are facts, proof is proof and the truth is the truth.

The problem that I have, here and in my daily life, can be summed up by what heiscominsoon said:

Why would a Christian ever change their viewpoint? If they did that..they undermine the very faith they say they support.
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If YOU aren't willing to admit you could be wrong, then why should ANYONE that you are witnessing to? That's tantamount to saying that you don't respect anyone else's views, but you want them to respect yours.

I have stated many, many times that I am more than willing to be proven wrong. It's the only way that one can grow. How many Christians here have been willing to say the same thing?

This is why many view Christianity as arrogant and why discussions such as these are incredibly frustrating.
 
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