Shees, this is getting long
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]I don't understand why you feel that validating the ONLY body of work that one bases their Faith on is trivial.
(Christ never asked me to validate the Bible.)
Christ never said ANYTHING about the Bible did he? The Bible wouldn't come into existence until much much later. If I'm going to be handed a book and told to base my life on it, I'd like to know the Book is accurate and authentic.
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]I would rather understand why those discrepancies are there than to turn a blind eye to it and accept the general whole.
(That is good; God did not call me to do that. Is that the burden he placed in your heart? Do the mistranslations you find, change the very meaning of Christ’s teachings? No they don’t, there for I do not understand what you are truly searching for my friend? UI am not turning a blind eye to it, I wait for the Lord to show me through the word of knowledge or wisdom. Christ never called us to understand (There is not wrong with understanding, and I myself despise lemmings) But Christ called us to have faith and believe.)
Psalm 119:34
Give me understanding, and I will keep your law and obey it with all my heart.
Psalm 119:73
Your hands made me and formed me; give me understanding to learn your commands.
Proverbs 4:1
Listen, my sons, to a father's instruction; pay attention and gain understanding.
Proverbs 4:7
Wisdom is supreme; therefore get wisdom. Though it cost all you have, [ 4:7 Or [ Whatever else you get ] ] get understanding.
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]That's not quite true. I am not trying to disprove the Bible, quite the opposite; I am trying to PROVE it.
(Where did God command you to prove it? To Questions his reality?)
Hebrews 11:6
And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him.
How is one to BELIEVE in God, to place FAITH in him if one doesn't prove it to himself?
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Obviously you got past that. I would love to hear how you learned to embrace a book that is riddled with errors and misconceptions. They obviously didn't disappear, so how do you deal with them?
(I studied again. I realized on day discussing the KJV that God would not allow His word to be corrupted; He had a specific message for us! And no matter what translation or version it stands. Christ is our salvation and gave us the great commission and Greatest of all commandments. God told me Stop walking and trying to prove I exist, Just believe and have faith in me. I did it very hard, I live like you and find myself wasting time trying to prove something that I already know is real.)
I find myself learning more the more I study. It's not a waste of time or effort if I'm learning and growing in the process.
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Nothing can disprove God's reality. On the flipside, nothing can prove God's reality either. What do you do when you find something that you can't understand? I understand that the last thing you would want to do is to invalidate the Bible, but have you honestly and truthfully VALIDATED it? Or have you simply accepted it without asking too many questions?
(THIS is not true, if you have something that truly proves that Christ is not the son off God, That the Great commission is a lie and the greatest commandment is a fallacy. Please tell me and every other Christian on this board. By all means I do not want to be wasting my time.)
That is what I am trying to do. But some people don't want to see. There is too much fear. Who likes being proven wrong after all? But where are you going to start? How about with the only physical piece of evidence there is...the Bible.
[b said:
Quote[/b] ](I have validated it. I do research it, I read and compare where is it lying or misguide all you keep spouting it two reference that are not there, not meeting the (I do not know how many the are) Where are least mistranslations that are detrimental to Christianity. Please tell us.) ( I pray and study and wait on the Lord)
There are many many mistranslations and inconsistencies in the Bible. Are you truly telling me that with all your study that you haven't found ONE mistranslation or ONE inconsistency in the Bible? If you'd like to start a new thread on this, I'd be more than happy to oblige, but our space within this one is limited. Please, honestly answer if you haven't found ONE single error in the Bible.
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Am I not testing what the Word says? More than that, I am testing the Word. Yes, there is a message there, but look at what the message is in. Look at it's transmission. Look at the Bible. I study these discrepancies to learn more about the Bible. I for one am not willing to accept this work without question. I'd like to know its origins, where it came from, how it came into being, whose hands were instrumental in its design. Why is that a bad thing? Because you might learn something you don't want to? That won't make it any less truthful now will it?
(No it will not make it any less truthful, Gods hand was instrumental in it.)
AHHH...I never conceded that his hand wasn't instrumental, but that isn't the point is it? If we assume that God gave man a single, unadulterated work, can you honestly tell me that work exists pure and unchanged to this day?
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]You may not feel that God owes you an explanation, but what is wrong with trying to understand more about God and who this being truly is? All we have to go on is the Bible, that's ALL we have, so why not scrutinize it? If God truly created the universe then all the study that one can do will prove that. The fear is in proving something that you don't want to believe in or in finding something that ruins your preconceived notions. Don't fear Truth.
(Pal, I agree, where does it disprove GOD, or Christ. How is the bible fallible? God Created the Universe, is this in question?)
You're putting the cart before the horse. Start at the beginning. If the Bible is the infallible word of God and it is shown to be indeed, fallible, then it casts a shadow on the rest.
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]If I'm going to base my life, and afterlife, on a book, I'd like to know who wrote it. If someone tells me to read this book on Ethics written by Mother Theresa, I'm going to be a little disturbed to find out it was really written by Larry Flint, or edited by Charles Manson. Open your Bible. Chances are it says the first five books of the Bible were written by Moses. Are you going to blindly accept that or are you going to prove it to yourself? How much stronger will your Faith be when you prove it to be so? But what happens if you find that it isn't so? Yes, it's easier to turn a blind eye and not even bother to question it. But how very sad for you if you do so. You're living in fear of the truth.
(My bible does not say the 1st five books were written by Moses, I have seen them refered to as the books of mosses.)(NIV) and we have come along way from control to relationship with Christ. So I know the books were inspired by God. We come to the same place I do not fear the truth, I do not choose to call God fallible. And stand by Faith God will make it clear.)
The KJV and the NKJV do state this, as well as others. My point is that people honestly believed that the Pentateuch was written by Moses, but over time that was proven inaccurate, which is why it is no longer in newer versions of the Bible. If that point was incorrect, what other notions commonly held about the Bible are incorrect as well?
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Those silly little details are what help build a strong foundation of your Faith. If you are building a house, you don't giggle and dismiss the pouring of concrete for the foundation. It's the most important part! Even Christ talks about building on a solid foundation. I refuse to squint my way through life and see only the big picture. It's easier not to question and just accept things the way they are. Again, here's the F word...FEAR. If you don't ask questions then you won't find things that you are afraid to face.
(Please tell me Where Christ said “get the silly details and have faith in me?) I have no fear , I stand on the bible and my Faith in Christ)
Hey, even Christ's disciples had doubt. Before I can place my faith in Christ, I need to be sure the Bible is what it says it is.
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Guess what? I agree with you. But it is much easier to say than to do. Trust is an "assured reliance on the character, ability, strength, or truth of someone or something". In order to have trust in an improvable being, you need to have Faith. In order to have Faith in God you have to understand God. In order to understand God you have to believe in the Bible. You can't believe in the Bible unless you truly study it. That is what I am doing, studying the Bible. Every facet of it. Some of it is good, some of it is bad, but in the end, it is what it is.
(trust in God comes not from understanding to, but for faith, bottom line. But Christ pushed faith. We walk my faith, not by sight)
ALL religions push faith, because it is impossible to prove. As I've said, before you can believe what's IN the Bible, you have to believe IN the Bible.
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]I am not living as a New Testament Christian. Does that make me a bad person? Does that mean I am devoid of morality?
(nope, I like you, I get the feeling you are a good person, Let me rephrase that. GOD tells me you are a good person, even as I write this. You are not a follower of Christ atm, But God has a work in you*Smile* I look forward to seeing it blossom  )
I WAS a follower of Christ, but am no longer. I think that puts me in a very bad position Biblically speaking.
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Ah, but you HAVE opted for an easy out. It's easier not to question your beliefs. You've said yourself that you prefer to look at the big picture instead of truly investigating the crumbled foundation under your feet
(This my friend are wrongs a soup sandwich. I question God to no end, and he always ends up proving me silly. I haven been a lot of things, but good has always made me a questioner. My foundation is solid and unshakeable. I walk what I talk. I have faith. This is what you fail to understand. You will not understand it until you get it.)
I also question God to no end, but I always end up finding him silly. And for your understanding, I HAVE had Faith. Don't kid yourself, it IS shakeable. As solid as any belief is, there is nothing stronger than Truth.
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Will he work on my heart like he did Pharoh's? How many times did God harden his heart when Moses beseeched the release of his people?
(Yes, God had a plan for Pharaoh, God has a plan for you, do I know it no, But It is there, I feel it, God shown me that you will do something. I do not know what it is, But He loves you and has a plan for you.)
God loved Pharaoh too didn't he? Things didn't work out well for him.
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]What TRUTH is in your heart? Can you have Truth without anything to back it up? Isn't the Bible supposed to back you up? Again, what is the problem with investigating the Bible?
(Nothing, I did not say the was anything wrong with it, and the bible backs up everything I am say, how doesn’t it, LOL)
The Bible may not back up everything you think it does.
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]You have to have SOME form of understanding don't you? Some how, some where you chose to believe in God and the Bible. How much questioning did you do to get yourself to that point? At what point do you stop questioning? Do you stop?
( A lot, I remember crying on the couch, having lost everything, I had started studying again, and saw so many misconceptions I had, and here it was making sense and it was all true. I was the angry confused one. Somehow I turned it all around.
God changed me, changed my heart, took my anger and self pity. I have never stop questioning, I ACCEPTED Gods plan for my life, and gave it to GOD. And he has not let me down yet. How could I not believe?)
Strange how two people can study the same book and wind up with totally opposite points of view.
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]I've chosen not to stop. I've chosen to continue questioning.
( Either have I , I just chose to live Gods way)
I suppose I live my own way, I guess we simply found different answers.