Revelation/Reading

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Revalation is probably the vaguest book in the Bible. Surprise, surprise.

I tried to read it again. Tried. I don't think anyone can successfully plod through that book understanding it in its entirety, no matter the notes they jot down or the inspirations they have.

What is God saying in this book? Sometimes I wonder if it's God at all who said anything. In chapter three or so he mentions something about people who "defile their garments".

What does that mean?
Just one instance of completely vague statements that seem to be very important, namely, whether or not someone winds up damned.

Why is Revelation so vague?



There's another thing too. When I read the Bible, or parts of it, over and over, I see things that I missed the time before. I read the entire chapter, or the entire book, I saw everything. Then I go over it again and there's something new. Not a new verse, but just something new. Something I didn't see before. Like an entire verse had been blocked out of memory.
Does this happen to any other readers? It bugs me. Why does it happen? Is it God purposefully blocking me from reading something until a later date?

I don't know. Any thoughts on the matter?
 
Revelation is a hard read. Much of it is about prophesy to come, thus part of the difficulty. This is the verse you were talking about:

Thou hast a few names even in Sardis which have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with me in white: for they are worthy. Revelation 3:4

Those who walk with Christ in the clean garments of real practical holiness here, and keep themselves unspotted from the world, shall walk with Christ in the white robes of honour and glory in the other world: this is a suitable reward.

This partial quote concerning this verse, was taken from the site, in 3:4 of the Revelation portion. I have the quote linked to the site. This is a good source when you don't understand something in the Bible, it links to Matthew Henry's Commentaries.

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Sometimes I wonder if it's God at all who said anything.
I understand your discouragement. But we know:

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: II Timothy 3:16

A recently heard a preacher say that we will continue to learn things from the Word forever...even in Heaven! Considering God is the Word, that doesn't surprise me!

I will read and not see something until later. I think it is exciting!! God will speak through the Bible and sometimes what you are seeing is exactly what you may need at the moment! Look at it this way, when we are 104, we will be thrilled that there continues to be new and exciting precepts that we have not seen!

Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. II Timothy 2:15

If you do a word study from a concordance on patience, you will see many blessings and benefits of this Christian virtue. I believe, God teaches us patience in all things, even the study of His Word. Have patience with yourself. I have no doubt that God is well pleased that you are willing to read the Bible and learn. Psalm 119 has lots of gold nuggets concerning the Bible.

Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee. Psalm 119: 11

Don't let the enemy discourage you as you read, study, and strive to understand, the Bible. I encourage you to keep up the good work:) One day we shall hear, "Well done, my good and faithful servant!"
 
Let me also throw out this thought regarding Revelation

We tend to think of things in a linear fashion. It is easier for our minds to process information in this way. But, is is possible that the events described in the book are actually occurring at the same time?

I too find new things out when I read the Bible. The book of Genesis is my favorite, but it was only the last time I read it did I discover that different ways that God introduces various parts of Himselft to us. I read a chapter a night and was awestruck.

Sometimes, I love it [when new things pop out] and to be honest, other times it is frustrating. I think, though, the frustration is because I want to know so much about my Father.

Gen
 
Wow, Revelation.

This is a very difficult book. It is also a very exciting book. I think Genesis pointed out a great thing. You cannot (to borrow a star trek phrase) think of it in a normal space time continuim. Revelation has happened, is occurring and will occur all at once. At the same time, we try to make sense of the imagary (IE- Locust must be helicopters) when the imagery was written for people in the first or second century. We must enjoy the book for what it is: prophecy. WHen you read it try not to understand everything, simply allow the words to paint pictures in your mind. YOu do not have to KNOW or UNDERSTAND it all. I would also HIGHLY recommend studying it with a good commentary, not just a study Bible.

It is a fascinating book. But, it is not pure teaching material like the gospels or other books in scripture. It must be approached in a different manner. It is good for teaching and instruction, but one has to adjust one's thinking when reading it.
 
Question arises then:

Who can show that the words we have are the words of God? Are God-inspired? Couldn't I just write some stuff up, after careful study of the Scriptures, the writers' styles and what God may or may not desire and then say, "Behold! More on the Word of God!"

Who canonized it all? We're missing books and prophecies. A read of the OT will reveal that several prophets' and I believe even a couple judges' words are missing completely. Is the Bible complete? Do we lack? If so, do we lack a vital thing, some key verse that the rest of the Bible needs?

I dunno, and it bugs me. And I don't know if we should even attempt to interpret Revelation, since someone else will come along with a different viewpoint on it and since it's obscure prophecy, we'll never get the whole picture until it happens, and by that time, we'll be dead or, supposedly, "raptured".
 
Revelation my favorite book im not sure why just whenever i read its scary yet in the end we all know what happens
smile.gif
 
While Revelation has a lot of exciting prospects in it, it is only one book of the Bible. It does bring comfort as it portrays the future, but we must be careful to keep our focus on the present. Earlier in the Bible, we are told to not worry about tomorrow, only focus on today. During the time we are here, working towards the furthering of God's kingdom on this earth should be a higher focus that what will happen in the end. To sum it up, in the end, God wins.

There are certain things that God will hide from us. If we know that the return of Christ will be on a certain date, what motivation do we have to work to spread God's message of love and salvation now? We could just sit back and wait.

The cannonization of the Bible took place over many years. It was done to preserve the intergrity of God's word without emporers or kings adding to the Bible and claiming it is God's word. After the Bible has stood in its present form for over a thousand years, I think that if something was missing, it would have been corrected many years ago.

Gen
 
I would like to add that there are many verses proclaiming the Bible to be the Word of God. First and foremost was that He was the Word in the flesh.

And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. John 1:14

The enemy tried to destroy God's Word from day one.

Now the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.
And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. Genesis 3:1-4

With his subtil ways, the enemy tried to use Gods Word against Jesus! He hasn't changed today. He still wants to twist, turn, and shed doubt on what God says. From Genesis to Revelation, by faith, I know, that I know, that I know, that I know, the Word He gave us is exactly the Word He wanted us to have, for He, and His every Word, is mighty and powerful! God's Word is our sword to fight the enemy. Believe it!
 
Only God understands it entirely. It's for us to decide on.

Dr. John Phillips, an amazing English speaker who I heard August 5th and the Southeastern Evangelism Conference, walked us through Revelations in 40 minutes. Every chapter. Get his commentary if you want to fully understand it. He is an amazing student of the Word, and He breaks it down so well and with so much knowledge.
 
I just loooovvveee a man in uniform! Is he married?  I would like to be partial owner of that sword!  Wooooweee!

Most men will proclaim every one his own goodness: but a faithful man who can find?  Proverbs 20:6
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Well the Bible was put here as a guideline for us to live. It is the inspiration of God in the written word, by many prophets/prophetesses. One key thing I would like to point out is that Revelations is one of the most complex books out there...you want to know why I believe so?

It's the last book. It's the book that talks about the final reckoning. When Christ will come again and such. It has more detail on that then most I believe.

A scripture I'd like to point out:

Revelations 2:7,11,17 'He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.'

That makes my point that it is our interpretation. What do you hear? Let the Spirit lead your ears and your decision making when it comes to this. The beginning portion talks about you being right or wrong, and how Christ feels about it.

Our Spirit tells us what to do, and what things mean. But we must hear. And if we hear with our heads it is something different. If we hear with the Spirit it is true.

Just like how a man can sit down read a scripture one day, and get a meaning off of it. Then look at it again 2 weeks later, you get another meaning out of it sometimes. Interpretation.

God Bless.
 
He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.  Revelation 2:7

He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches:  He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.  Revelation 2:11

He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches:  To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knowest saving he that receiveth it.  Revelation 2:17

Actually, this is not speaking of private interpretation.  Basically, it is saying, "Listen up!"  The remainder of the verse is telling you what God is wanting you to hear.

To understand a proverb, and the interpretation; the words of the wise, and their dark sayings.  Proverbs 1:6

On getting a different meaning, I understand.  Well, more like additional meaning.  An example, I had a Little Golden Book about the boy with the loaves and fishes.  I have read it many times.  He was generous...he was there to see Jesus...lots of stories can be derived from this one story.  But yesterday while reading it, I saw that the disciples were human.  Despite what they had seen and done through the LORD, they doubted they could feed all these.  You can read all kinds of things into their personalities and feelings at the time.  For one, they were starving and tired.  Something that I have never seen or heard in the story, concerning the 12 baskets left...the disciples gave out of their lack and had more than enough left over for themselves!  This may be the only time a man liked leftovers ;)  

Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
II Peter 1:20

Lastly, I cringe at some teachings today.  If what you see/hear/handle/taste/smell in is in line with Scripture, very well.  However, if those things do not line up perfectly with God's Word, it may be of the spirit, but the wrong spirit! In order to try the spirits, we gotta' know the Book!

We are told in Revelation not to add to the Book! I am afraid many add to God's Word by private interpretation.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Lastly, I cringe at some teachings today. If what you see/hear/handle/taste/smell in is in line with Scripture, very well. However, if those things do not line up perfectly with God's Word, it may be of the spirit, but the wrong spirit! In order to try the spirits, we gotta' know the Book!

Isn't this a vicious cycle? According to most Christians, you can't truly "know" the Bible unless you have the gift of the Spirit, but how are you to have the "right" spirit if you don't "know" the Bible?
 
You are to be in the Word.
If you live for Christ and have no other motives and are pure in your intentions to understand, God will bless you in this. Just what my pastor tells us.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]"When I read the Bible, or parts of it, over and over, I see things that I missed the time before. I read the entire chapter, or the entire book, I saw everything. Then I go over it again and there's something new. Not a new verse, but just something new. Something I didn't see before. Like an entire verse had been blocked out of memory.
Does this happen to any other readers? It bugs me. Why does it happen? Is it God purposefully blocking me from reading something until a later date?"

This does not just happening to you. When you find new answers in a verse, the Soly Spirit let you or rather is working in you, showing you things that you need to learn see or work on.

(RED's son speaking now)
When I read the Bible I see new things, but I don't think that it is God blocking you from anything, but it is God speaking to us again.  Remember that it is the living Word of God and that is is always true and that one verse can apply to several situations but when you read the verse you are going to automatically see it in a way that you need to at that moment.  Hope this help you out.
 
It all comes down to your wisdom. You can be book smart all you want, but it doesn't mean your knowledge is worth knowing.

Now if you're wise, you can take the knowledge you have and apply it to your life. The Bible being the Living guideline for us all, we are to apply it to our life.

If you do not understand a verse or some portion you truly need to seek counsel on it, I do all the time, with my mentor and my pastors, I let them interpret it for me, and then it is all for me to take in and try and understand what it means. Possibly purchase a study bible or a few commentaries on what you do not understand.

Thats the best I can do for you.
 
D.V., (Great to see you! I hope all is well with you and yours:) I don't think it is within our earthly flesh to even desire to know the Bible. God wants each and every one of us, and woos us to Himself. Being saved, having the Spirit, and knowing the Bible are freely available to all who seek the LORD. The very host of Heaven rejoices when our hearts are in tune with our Mighty God.

Likewise, I say unto you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner that repenteth. Luke 15:10

It may seem a vicious cycle, but all we have to do to acquire the Spirit and the understanding of God is ask.

If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him? Luke 11:13

Personally, without the Bible, I truly would not have the right Spirit. Any single thing that is good and right within me, I attribute to Him. I won't try to explain away the moral atheist, I know they probably exist. I know that we have a very cunning enemy that was cast from Heaven because of pride and wanting to be God. He is a god now, and will do everything within his power to keep us from God. It is my belief that consists of going to the lengths of deceiving people into believing that they are on a right and acceptable path and do not need God. What the enemy gets out of this, I have no idea, I would hope to God I can never think as he does.

Phix is right:

And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart. Jeremiah 29:13

It truly isn't difficult. Look at the plan of salvation, simple enough for a child to understand.

For all have sinned and come short of the glory of God.Romans 3:23
As it is written, There is none righteous, no not one.Romans 3:10
But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.Romans 5:8
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16
For whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.Romans 10:13

Plain. Simple. To the point. It is not a vicious cycle, for God said, "Whosoever will may come."

And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely. Revelation 22:17

Imagine! The Creator. God Himself! I cannot truly comprehend the magnitude of that invitation made possible by His sacrifice for us. Now that, is amazing love!
 
uck. this cycle is viciuos but you have to fight it. it's like saying to an addicted drug user. go ahead. you're gonna die someday. might as well have fun before you do. it's kind of um.... weird. dunno how to say it. well, what do you think about morals DV? just curious - spout off topic - like what do you think they come from? (Started.)
 
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