Do you not understand my position on this? As a minority in this country...heck, in this world, I am beset with Christianity on all sides. Now, normally this wouldn't be a big deal, but I don't take kindly to threats, and threats are exactly what Christianity teaches to nonChristians...convert or burn, simply put.
Would you mind explaining how nonChristians affect your belief? What, exactly, are you interested in here?
UH, no, you haven't tried to provide me with anything that even remotely resembles proof. All you have done is told me what helped YOU. And as you have already pointed out (thus agreeing with me) your proof does me no good.
It does you no good because you refuse to see it for what is...
And what is it?
My proof is my own personal experiences that I have tried to share with you but for whatever reason you are caught up on only wanting a certain type of proof. If I share an experience with you and tell me that that was the proof I needed, then take it for just that. I understand that you may need a different kind of proof, but how can you disregard what I claim is proof?
I don't disregard it as proof, since, obviously, you are a Christian, so it had an impact on you. My position is two-fold. I not sold on your proof being scientific proof, physically testable, therefore rational. Second, your proof, or anyone's proof, is no good to anyone else, unless that evidential proof can be shared. Otherwise, it's just a nice story. It becomes anecdotal evidence, useless to anyone but the story teller.
Haven't you listened to anything I've said?
I've lived that life and it did nothing for me.
So honestly, I ask in all sincerity. What would you have me do?
You say God is waiting for me...where was he when I earnestly sought him?
Exactly why should I spend any more time than the decades I put in already
Yeah actually I have listened to everything you said, thus would explain why I continue to come back day after day and continue to type these really long posts. Why should you spend anymore time seeking God, because, God's timing is different than ours. You put in decades as you say, well what if God's timing meant a few decades and five months? If you give up and don't continue to earnestly seek him, how can you tell if you're selling yourself short...let me ask you this - you say you put in decades searching for the Lord? am I correct? If so was your search simply that, just a search for the Lord or did your time in search of the Lord include asking/praying that he work in your life?
As a Christian, I had a complete Christian outlook. I studied, I prayed, I accepted Christ, etc. I worked, I studied, I prayed, I cried. I don't know how much more I could do. It was like taking a journey on a treadmill...I never actually got anywhere.
This goes back to what I mentioned earlier. If God exists, and is omniscient, then he should have known just how far he could make me wait before I gave up. Ask and it shall be given! Right?
I have no urge to go down that road again, no urge to waste more of my life in a fruitless pursuit.
You turned my words around on me, so I will be the bigger person here and take up your challenge. I hunger for the truth. What should I do to find it?
Turn to His word...that is where I have been able to find the truth I need...
Please look back at my posts. I have done that and found nothing.
I'll make you a deal, I promise to stop fighting you on that if you will just stop saying it
I won't stop saying it, sorry. It's about God's timing, not ours.
Then I won't won't stop fighting you on your silly saying. Silly? Yes, it lost any effectiveness it might have had long ago. Now, it's just annoying. And that fact that you keep saying it only emphasizes the annoyance.
I did ask nicely.
God created the world.
He created Satan.
He created evil.
He let man fall.
Those things are the works of GOD.
Was it God that let man fall, or was it his choice?
Let's see...
Who created Satan? God
Who created the Garden of Eden? God
Who created Man? God
Who allowed Satan entrance to the Garden of Eden? God
If God is omniscient than he knew, before Satan's creation, that he would facilitate the Fall of Man. Therefore, God PURPOSELY created Satan with the intent of making Man fall.
Therefore, God is responsible for the Fall of Man.
A choice? What were your other choices? Would your parents have approved?
My parents didn't really care about religion - yeah they believed in God but if we forgot our prayers it was no big deal...As far as other choices, I guess I never really looked in to other choices at the time - I found something that made me feel complete - I found the Lord and my search ended there but yet it also began - I began the search within to see what my beliefs were and I guess to a certain extent the proof I provided you was probably at about a time in my life where I was pretty close to giving up on the Lord....
BINGO.
I guess I never really looked in to other choices at the time
You no longer lack...no, you no longer want to look at other choices objectively. Who is to say that you wouldn't have felt complete and happy with Confusionism or another religion?
The truth is geography, culture, family and environment play a HUGE role in your religious makeup. Just take a look at a map, the facts are there.
I agree with you on that point, however, while those things may greatly influence somebody as they are growing and maturing, I also think that once you are out of that environment you are free to make changes as you see fit...I do a lot more reading of the Bible and stuff that I wouldn't have done at home - it was my choice to continue on that path, but even continuing on that path meant that some changes had to be made.
Point taken, but again, I point you to any map. Notice that geography has a large part to play in religion.
I could so easily be Buddhist, Hindu or Muslin - but the fact remains that I am a Christian....and let me ask you - Does it really matter what brought me to God? All that matters to me is that I do have an awesome Father watching out over me....
I asked you HOW you could easily be anything else, you avoided that question.
Does it matter how you came to be a Christian. It is at the very crux of the discussion. It is of the utmost import!
Sorry, but I am going to call your bluff on this one.
I don't think you COULD easily be anything but Christian. I say that because of the little I know, so please, if I'm wrong, correct me.
Why do you believe you could EASILY be Buddhist, Hindu and/or Muslim? They are not the same thing, in fact, they are wildly different. How much do you really know about those things? Do you know what the Four Noble Truths are? Have you read the Vedas? Do you know what the Five Pillars of Islam are?
I think your knowledge of Christianity FAR outweighs your knowledge of other religions. Again, I could be wrong. Am I?
It was a figure of speech, Eon mentioned that based on geography I could just as easily have been one of those, I was simply saying as a figure of speech, 'well i guess i could have been any of those, but the facts remain that i am a Christian.' not actually meaning that i could be buddhist or islamic does that make sense? you are right my knowledge of Christianity probably does outweigh my knowledge of any other religion....however, I do know the Four Noble Truths, I have read bits and pieces of the Vedas, and I know what the five pillars of Islam are....I know this because within the last two years I took a comparitive religions class in college (we looked closely at 6 religions) and I also took a cross-cultural class that dealt with different religions as well....do I know a huge amount about them - no, but I was open minded enough to learn what I could during that class....
A few questions for clarification: What setting was this class taken in? Was the instructor openly weighted to one religion? My best professors never told us where their beliefs lay, which was important to being objectie.
You have taken two classes in two years...arguably a small percentage to your overall experience with Christianity, no?
In all seriousness, I want to personally, and publicly thank Shyfroggy for active participation in this thread. It isn't always easy laying out your views for the world to see, especially when it's open for debate. Many people would have quit long before now, or simply shut the thread down. So I want to say thank you. For your patience and for the discussion.
And I'd like to thank you for causing me to take a closer look at my own beliefs...but I'd also like to say the following - thank God too - for it is Him who has provided me the patience needed to continue this dicussion as long as I have. (Just trying to point something out to you, please don't take offense.)
Sorry, I do have the medical magazine somewhere in the many boxes that are in my house full of stuff to be moved. When i find it, I'll post the name and issue number. 
![[toj.cc]phantom](/forums/data/avatars/m/1/1132.jpg?1442680067){kind=avatar}
