PAlly Questions

PapaToad

PapaToad

Active Member
As I stated I have a 58 Pally on the server i inherited. it Was Dawifes account but she no longer plays. Are Pallys viable Tanks i here good and bad things about them.

Can anyone send me some linkage on pally tanks? And give some advice good bad indifferent.
 
Pallies have been made very viable MT tanks including a recent progression kill of Illidian by a pally. There are great resource sites out there including maintankadin.failsafedesign.net and several other blogs out there.

There are pros and cons to pally tanks. Here is my take.

Pros
Awesome multiple target and undead/demon threat
Ability to pull 3 or more targets at once
Ability to taunt up to 3 mobs off a target
The best multiple target mitigation
The best fast hitting boss mitigation
Threat scales well through spell damage
Similar health to warriors after reaching uncrushable
Burst Threat

Cons
Stats are very spread out over gear (Key stats include Stamina, Defense, Dodge, Parry, Block, +Spell Damage, +Hit, +Spell Hit)
Requires you to maintain three or more sets of gear (tank/heal/dps/resist/stamina...)
Harder to reach uncrushable through gear as you have to make up 35% more mitigation then a warrior does
Lower starting health after reaching 70 compared to other tanks because of itemization
Stigma "get in the back and heal"
To be a MT, you have to specialized almost completely into protection
Requires similar gear to warriors
Requires similar 1h weapons as casters
 
Ok I need some help here, I have like ten thousand commands, i could roll a druid and level it in no time, same with a hunter. BUT you pallies have like so many buttons and they chain off each other (A stoopid concept) I would like to give my already 58 pally a chance at life.

How do I productive attack and solo with a mob, and then what do I chain to tank. I am looking for button(spell) sequence.

If any pallies could give me a hand(advice ) on this I would applicate it.Otherwise I will park her and roll a druid again................
 
Pull (one of the following)
Avenging Shield
Consecrate
Exorcism
Holy Wrath
Run in screaming "I am the Lawgivah!"
Let the stupid DPS pull, take a seat, wait 1-2 hits for the DPS to die, pick up all the mobs and tank them

Rotation Multi Mob or quick agro
Consecrate
Seal of Righteousness
Holy Shield
Judge Righteousness
Re-Seal of Righteousness
Rinse and Repeat taking into consideration Holy Shield cool down above all other abilities

Rotation Boss
Consecrate
Seal of the Crusader
Holy Shield
Judge Seal of the Crusader
Seal of Vengeance
Let it stack a couple times
Judge Vengeance
Rinse and Repeat, a 5 stack of SoV will stay up as long as you have SoV on while in melee so you typically have to let it stack fully once


Why Seal of Righteousness (SoR) vs Seal of Vengeance (SoV)? SoR is great for snap agro as the judgement is always for the same amount. SoV judges for more after you have a full stack of debuffs on the target. So for short quick fights when you might not get a full stack of SoV applied or where you need to establish agro quickly go with SoR. For long fights like individual bosses use SoV. You will generate more threat per second with SoV after you get the stack up.

So those are my two generic suggestions for rotations. The reason I open with consecrate and not Holy Shield after a pull is because you don't want to let HS charges go to waste as often times during a pull, the mobs are slowed by Avenging Shield until they get to you. Feel free to sprinkle in healthy doses of trinkets, consumables and Exorcisms when needed.

Soloing Mobs
This really depends on the mob. I would recommend that you single out spell using mobs. Pallies have poor spell mitigation unless you are combining resist gear with an aura. Melee mobs can be solo'd one of two ways. If they are low damage mobs, pull many to you and AOE grind them down. Redoubt, holy shield, blessing of sanctification and ardent defender help you mitigate a lot of damage. If they are heavy hitting mobs with lots of health (like elite mobs) pull as singles and use seal/judgement of light/wisdom with a fast one hand (and reckoning) to extend your health/mana regen. Never equip a two hander to solo. Sword and board is the only way to go unless you severely want to gimp your DPS output. To kill things quicker, mix in spell damage/healing plate. To last longer, mix in tanking plate.
 
I can only add a few comments to sandrics very informative post:) I usually cast my first seal before I pull the mob, and usually get a seal of righteousness ready, then pull then as its coming in hit consecrate and holy shield and judge righteousness as soon as its in range. If its a boss fight then I would seal of vengeance, letting it stack until cooldown on judge is up and do a seal of crusader and instantly judge it then go back to vengeance, if its trash I just keep going with righteousness. Reason I use righteousness is to frontload as much threat as possible because most dpsers are used to pally tanks being able to hold aggro right from the start(and some even get in before the mob ever touches us) hehe.
 
also using consecration and then holy shield helps the cooldowns come up at different times, if you use holy shield and then consecration they expire at the same time and you have to do one or the other(and holy shield is usually more important) so if you keep using holy shield it will keep happening over and over:P

soloing mobs is weak, unless its some sort of boss elite I tried to gather 3-4 mobs at least when grinding my way to 70 and farming after 70, you will use just as much mana killing 1 mob solo as you will grinding away 3-4 as long as they are mostly melee(and will come gather around you and fight you there not stand back casting spells)
 
it look spretty daunting when you see it all typed out like that but I pretty much learned what to do by myself as I was levelling up(farmed a lot of instances for rep before I quested to maximise rep gain:P) and it comes pretty easy. I look at my damage output and consecration is usually one of the highest damage I do so I figure that is where most of my threat comes from, and the 90% increased threat from holy shield blocks:)
 
I followed the directions and its pretty easy a couple of buttons, I figure once I get a level or two, or even after thanksgiving weekend, I would love for some peeps to accompany me, through ramparts or any instance my level & allow me to tank and help (suggest) some things that would make me good at (MT) (OT) and even healing once I have the correct gear.

I think I would like the MT (OT) role allot. I can heal and proved well as a Druid healer, so just getting the right mind frame for Pally healing will be a breeze I think.

So maybe this weekend, or even maybe this coming week, we can get few alts who are my level or some old faces to teach me to tank, so Aves can stop Whining about no (MT’s) Just kidding buddy. I will slowly work on Papa, but I have a perfectly good Pally and I am beginning to understand how to play her. So I think it would be quicker to level her.

So let me know who and what times are good, because I will spend the next 10 level learning to tank, and then the real game begins @ 70


Thanks everyone for your help
 
i know some info about pally tanks but ive been holy spec for so long im better at it. i would like a chance to get geared and be a tank though champ always seems to put me down about it.
 
Papa, per our conversation tonight. Here is the macro from the 102.4% combined mitigation needed to be uncrushable:

http://blessingofkings.blogspot.com/2007/07/avoidance-macro.html

But don't forget to focus on hitting 490 defense and 120-160 spell damage first. Uncrushable next after that. Then decide to go for Stamina and/or Spell Damage.

Look at the following thread for info on the Righteous Defense macro I talked about and lots of great Tankadin links towards the end of the second page:

http://www.cgalliance.org/forums/showthread.php?t=18512&highlight=macro&page=2
 
Cool and thank you so much for all the help. I do have another question is is stamina to raise my health, I keep hearing I tank well enough and seem to be able to pull agrro when I need to, but They say my health pool is too small. How do I raise it so that I am not needing smap heals?
 
sandric, quick question here. is the 5piece pally tank set really worth getting or should i just go for gear similar to it in heroics?
 
So have her parked (Toadgirl) and am building her up for rested XP. I also play on Cenarion Circle, but I have my crossbow now so I am parking that character, and saving for running with RL friends now and then.

Papatoad is level 9 and as much as I like Druids and they will always be partial to my heart. I have a 62 and a 50 on horde and alliance.

SO I made a tank, a regular sword and board, no healing, no casting, just a plate wearing, they stop here, tank, and I really like it, so much that I rolled two one horde and one alliance. So I figure whenever Toadgirl or my hunter are down or resting for exp.

I will be on with, oh you’ll see soon enough.

Now about my Paladin is it worth it to enchant the blues that are dropping form the instances in outlands with stamina buffs to raise my health or will that come by 70?
 
Sorry, been kept busy at work the last couple of days and to burnt out to do much afterwords.

@Brugmeister
As far as the T4 set, there are several pieces that are pretty good to get. For instance, the shoulders that drop of HKM are better then the T5 shoulders on Void Reaver. On the other hand, the Iron Gauntlets of the Maiden are better then the T4 gauntlets. As we are not on Mag yet and Nightbane is unfriendly to tanks, I would recommend shooting for the badge reward chest over the T4 chest. The Aldor/Scryer tanking chests are also nice stand ins.

@Papa
Cheap gems and enchants are better then no enchants. Early on you may want to spend your gems on enduring talasites (10-15g stam/def gem) to help reach uncrushable and add health but I would hold off on Solid Stars of Elunes (30-40g stam gem) until later on when you have some nice purples to set them in since they are more expensive.
 
I wouldnt waste gold on rare gems until you get 70 blues at least, You will be lucky to hit uncrittable much less uncrushable before you hit 70, the minute I hit 70 I hit uncrittable(490 defense) but I couldnt do it before hand, the felsteel stuff helped a ton:) I would get +stam gems(the 1g~ variety) and fill up all gem slots and just go for as much health as possible until you hit 70. Stam was basically all I worried about before hitting 70, knothide armor kits are cheap and easy stam too if you know a leatherworker, or the bank may have some still I know Illyria sent a ton to the bank awhile ago
 
What ever cheap gems you need let me know and I'll mail them to you no cost. I have a stack of each color in my bank and sell hundreds a week.
 
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