Is internet community enough?
- Thread starter the_great_eskimo_pie
- Start date
Abba San
Legacy of Elijah [LoE] - Proud Grandfather
the link didn't take me to an article - just a CrossWalk page that was empty...
the_great_eskimo_pie
Former Official Thread Killer
I see that... Strange, it worked earlier...
I tried from the main page of the site and it doesn't work. Something tells me they may be updating or removing it then.
I tried from the main page of the site and it doesn't work. Something tells me they may be updating or removing it then.
Abba San
Legacy of Elijah [LoE] - Proud Grandfather
Still...an interesting question. I'd have to say, no.
Durruck
Pirate!
I agree. While CGA and other online Christian forums are a good addition, it should not be our only form of coming together. Perhaps in places where Christianity is outlawed and the church is not well-developed, it's a very important subsidization, but still should not be the "only" fellowship.
the_great_eskimo_pie
Former Official Thread Killer
The link works again!
XionTawa
New Member
I say no, but I have no choice, I live in a small city, that doesn't have any decent churches I have attended, and know no one but family... We have tried to connect with certain groups of "Christians" for the last 10 years and it ends up with them not being very Christian, so the relationships get ended... And everyone that was real with us has moved away...
ursen
Officer SOE/LoE/Where's "here"?
There are those that find face to face relationships so painful and difficult that Internet community is about the only choice for community. Panic attacks in the middle of group discussions are very hard to explain.
ewoksrule
Active Member
While hard to explain, true face to face Christian community is the perfect place for one to have a panic attack and receive the proper support. It might take "going out of comfort zone" on everyone's behalf to deal with it, but I think that is exactly what God has in mind.
Lloren
Christian Gamers Alliance Forums Administrator
+Like
ursen
Officer SOE/LoE/Where's "here"?
Once bitten twice shy. Thrice bitten forever gone.
Abba San
Legacy of Elijah [LoE] - Proud Grandfather
Sure - there will always be deviations from the norm - but the norm for relationships is face to face. That doesn't negate the joy of long distant - be they pen-pal or phone or cyber - relationships, but the norm for healthy, lasting, intimate relationships is face to face.
ewoksrule
Active Member
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Chaska
New Member
What concerns me is that my read of the article says the biggest problem with lack of community is that the big bad gov't is going to get you. The other issues that come with lack of community are, in my opinion, far worse. I like having both a virtual community and a 'face-to-face'. If I had to choose, I'd pick face-to-face every time. It's harder, it's messier, but, "Where there are no oxen, the manger is empty, but from the strength of an ox come abundant harvests." AKA It's easier to clean up w/o the oxen, but there's good things that come from their strength. Of course, I'm talking about real face-to-face community, not "Hi, how are you? (what I actually mean is please say 'fine' so that I can move on and still feel like I've fulfilled my social requirements)" community. I hate that and would rather go heal my raid where my tank will send me a whisper checking on my grandfather in the hospital.
Odale
Active Member
The short answer is no.
The long answer is nnnnnnnnnnnnnooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo.
The long answer is nnnnnnnnnnnnnooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo.
Durruck
Pirate!
I've noticed a few people at church have stopped asking me how I am. Because I don't give the "fine" answer. Most of us aren't "fine" and I'm not going to lie about the fact I'm struggling, weak, or weary. And when I ask others how they are, I ask because I genuinely want to know. I don't want "fine"
Abba San
Legacy of Elijah [LoE] - Proud Grandfather
In general, I agree with you Durruck - but having taught an English as second language class - working on colloquialisms - you do have to take into consideration that in our culture, "Hey, how are you doing?" is a standard form of address - very similar to, "Hello." Most people are NOT inquiring how you are actually doing - they are acknowledging your presence. I do my walking on the water-front - I pass a lot of people - they and I often nod and say, "Hey, how are you?" and just keep on walking. Neither of us thinks the other was rude.
Durruck
Pirate!
True. But have we digressed so much as to take to ignoring the hearts-in-need of our fellow man? When i want to know how someone is doing, I shouldn't have to say "no, really...how are you doing?"
If I want to acknowledge someone without engaging in conversation, "hello" and "good afternoon" seem like a better option than "how are you?"
If I want to acknowledge someone without engaging in conversation, "hello" and "good afternoon" seem like a better option than "how are you?"
After reading the article, I can't help but feel that many of Colson's points either don't apply to our community or apply to a far lesser degree than many online communities.
If a person participates in our community with a false persona, he or she will not give or receive anything of significant value. What we gain from the CGA community--encouragement, fellowship, support--we gain because we represent ourselves, for the most part, as we are.
I don't mean to imply that we openly share all our faults and foibles; digital communication provides a more severe "filter" for who and what we are, allowing us to choose what we share and how. In that sense, I agree with Colson.
But people present themselves as they wish others to see them in face-to-face interactions as well. We hide our faults, our flaws, and our sins in "real life" just as we do in online communities. In some respects, we are more protective of what we wish to hide in face-to-face communication than when communicating online. For example: It's easier for a Christian man to share about his struggle with addiction in our Men's Forums than in a public church setting. The search for help shouldn't stop there, but it can start online.
Yet I must still answer, "No" to the question posed by this thread. Online community is most definitely not enough. I have never--at least not purposely--suggested otherwise.
I have stated repeatedly that the CGA is not intended to be a replacement for local church involvement.
My vision for our community is that it is supplemental and transitional:
Supplemental: Rather than replacing involvement in a local church, participation in the CGA community and/or one of its affiliates supplements the fellowship and ministry in which many of us are already involved.
Transitional: Some community members are not currently attending or involved in a local church--some because they're currently in a transitional period of life (e.g. moving every few months during graduate rotations, searching for a new church home after moving to a new city, upset by a church split and cautiously seeking a new church home, etc.) and some because they lack the desire to do so.
One of the purposes of the CGA community is to encourage Christians not already attending and involved in a local church to start attending a doctrinally sound local church and get involved. It's a burden on my heart and one purpose that I feel I have not expressed clearly or passionately enough.
The fellowship we enjoy and the encouragement we find in this community are genuine, but they are not meant to be the only fellowship and encouragement we have. We are all called to join a local church, submit to spiritual authority (as that preacher follows Christ, of course), and give your time, talents, and money to help a local church perform God's will.
I have had negative experiences at local churches. I have tired of "church shopping." (My wife and I visited approximately 40 churches before finding our church home in St. Louis. We didn't intend to be picky; we simply did not have a peace about "settling in" until we found the right church.) I can certainly sympathize with those who participate in online Christian communities and convince themselves that it's "enough."
After leading Tribe of Judah, a Christian gaming group, for 12 and a half years and leading an alliance of Christian gaming groups and web sites for several years, I can assure you that Internet community is not enough.
But the Christian Gamers Alliance and its affiliates are important supplemental and transitional communities for many people. And we should never underestimate the value of that.
Note that I didn't discuss the topic of witnessing to non-Christians. We have additional opportunities to share the Gospel with others online and should be prepared to the best of our ability for those conversations. But online evangelism is a topic that warrants its own separate thread. My post is specifically addressing Christian community.
If a person participates in our community with a false persona, he or she will not give or receive anything of significant value. What we gain from the CGA community--encouragement, fellowship, support--we gain because we represent ourselves, for the most part, as we are.
I don't mean to imply that we openly share all our faults and foibles; digital communication provides a more severe "filter" for who and what we are, allowing us to choose what we share and how. In that sense, I agree with Colson.
But people present themselves as they wish others to see them in face-to-face interactions as well. We hide our faults, our flaws, and our sins in "real life" just as we do in online communities. In some respects, we are more protective of what we wish to hide in face-to-face communication than when communicating online. For example: It's easier for a Christian man to share about his struggle with addiction in our Men's Forums than in a public church setting. The search for help shouldn't stop there, but it can start online.
Yet I must still answer, "No" to the question posed by this thread. Online community is most definitely not enough. I have never--at least not purposely--suggested otherwise.
I have stated repeatedly that the CGA is not intended to be a replacement for local church involvement.
My vision for our community is that it is supplemental and transitional:
Supplemental: Rather than replacing involvement in a local church, participation in the CGA community and/or one of its affiliates supplements the fellowship and ministry in which many of us are already involved.
Transitional: Some community members are not currently attending or involved in a local church--some because they're currently in a transitional period of life (e.g. moving every few months during graduate rotations, searching for a new church home after moving to a new city, upset by a church split and cautiously seeking a new church home, etc.) and some because they lack the desire to do so.
One of the purposes of the CGA community is to encourage Christians not already attending and involved in a local church to start attending a doctrinally sound local church and get involved. It's a burden on my heart and one purpose that I feel I have not expressed clearly or passionately enough.
The fellowship we enjoy and the encouragement we find in this community are genuine, but they are not meant to be the only fellowship and encouragement we have. We are all called to join a local church, submit to spiritual authority (as that preacher follows Christ, of course), and give your time, talents, and money to help a local church perform God's will.
I have had negative experiences at local churches. I have tired of "church shopping." (My wife and I visited approximately 40 churches before finding our church home in St. Louis. We didn't intend to be picky; we simply did not have a peace about "settling in" until we found the right church.) I can certainly sympathize with those who participate in online Christian communities and convince themselves that it's "enough."
After leading Tribe of Judah, a Christian gaming group, for 12 and a half years and leading an alliance of Christian gaming groups and web sites for several years, I can assure you that Internet community is not enough.
But the Christian Gamers Alliance and its affiliates are important supplemental and transitional communities for many people. And we should never underestimate the value of that.
Note that I didn't discuss the topic of witnessing to non-Christians. We have additional opportunities to share the Gospel with others online and should be prepared to the best of our ability for those conversations. But online evangelism is a topic that warrants its own separate thread. My post is specifically addressing Christian community.
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No, a internet community is not enough. It doesn't mean it can't be useful (as Tek7 wrote), especially to those who have difficulties with face to face interactions.
But in the end, you make most of the important and more in-depth contacts offline. Even if they were first made online. Social contact on the internet tends to be limited in some ways. You can't hear someone's tone of voice, which can tell the intent of what is spoken. If that person was making a joke, if they are cheerful, grumpy, etc. Sometimes there is a delay of response (like on forums) and there is body language and so on. So the internet will not be able to replace real life contacts.
And the social contacts of many places on the internet have their share of problems. Social networks. You can have literally hunderds of "friends", who you don't know or have no contact with, etc.
But in the end, you make most of the important and more in-depth contacts offline. Even if they were first made online. Social contact on the internet tends to be limited in some ways. You can't hear someone's tone of voice, which can tell the intent of what is spoken. If that person was making a joke, if they are cheerful, grumpy, etc. Sometimes there is a delay of response (like on forums) and there is body language and so on. So the internet will not be able to replace real life contacts.
And the social contacts of many places on the internet have their share of problems. Social networks. You can have literally hunderds of "friends", who you don't know or have no contact with, etc.
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