Heroics

[Daire]

I would like to begin going through heroics. I am looking for good players to come along, smart, fun, able to think on your feet, and well geared. There is a lot of loot for us all in heroics that we should start working on. I am currently not keyed for heroics in hellfire, however I am keyed for Auchidoun and coilfang. So if you are truly interested in getting some practice rather than jumping feet over head into karaz, lets work something out

 

[FiremanThul]

I am keyed for coilfang and hellfire.. I am quite nervous about the heroics tbh.. I'm looking forward to the "lower level" heroics (i.e. slave pens instead of steamvaults)..

We might wanna consider waiting until after the patch, I think I read that they are going to be adjusting the heroic loot table.

 

[Durruck]

I'm with Mike. I'm looking forward to them, but nervous, nonetheless. I've been hearing that heroics can be pretty tough - clothies getting one-shotted by trash mobs. That makes me QQ.

 

[Daire]

I'm with Mike. I'm looking forward to them, but nervous, nonetheless. I've been hearing that heroics can be pretty tough - clothies getting one-shotted by trash mobs. That makes me QQ.

No problem being nervous, I get nervous when I tank in a new place. These are places we have run quite a few times, what is different..they hit harder. You lose some of that room for error..but nervous or not Id rather do it than talk about doing it otherwise ..never know when we will get around to it. I mean the worst that can actually happen is we go in, we wipe, we lose some fake money...and we have fun? Im pretty sure whoever the first group was that went heroic didnt survive their very first run....so pull up your skirts, lets have some fun!!

 

[Ambryana]

I've got the heroic key for coilfang, so I can help with that. I need more rep for the other keys.

(P.S. I hope pulling up my skirt is optional for this run LoL.)

 

[Daire]

LOL you know what I meant.. I didnt mean ALL the way up..silly mage lol

 

[Kagnus]

5 of us ran our first heroic tonight, slave pens. A prot warrior, prot paladin, frost mage, marksman hunter and a holy priest.

Holly is right, room for error is very small. Also, aggro management is huge. Some of these mobs can one/two shot hunters in mail armor and worse on cloth. Tanks need to be on their toes making sure those who are not tank material just don't get a melee hit.

We managed to get to the first boss, Mennu, with just two wipes (iirc). And we took Mennu down on the first try, each of getting our first badge of justice - woot! But from what we understand he is the easiest of the heroic bosses.

I was on Kagnus, and off-tanked for the most part. Tinie and I had to often taunt off each other to give Aevista, our healer, time to get one of us to full health. On tanks these mobs hit between 2500-3000. A well geared pre-heroic, pre-Karazhan tank should have between 11k-12k health, that is about 4 unmittigated non-crit hits to live through before a heal. Good dodge, parry and block help a lot.

 

[Daire]

Righto, this is partially why I am wondering how people think they will survive karaz.

From my understanding, these heroics require a good deal of dps. Having multiple or a couple tanks might not work, as it is a loss in dps. Anyway, congrats to you and your group for going in.

 

[Woven]

Some of these mobs can one/two shot hunters in mail armor and worse on cloth. Tanks need to be on their toes making sure those who are not tank material just don't get a melee hit.

Sounds like both tanks and dps need to be on their toes. And everyone needs to play smart. You can't go dps crazy right from the start. It also sounds like every single bit of threat generation is going to be needed from tanks to hold aggro, so that's another reason I may go protection specced for defiance. (to name just one)

Tinie and I had to often taunt off each other to give Aevista, our healer, time to get one of us to full health.

On regular trash mobs? Were you able to heal yourself a bit on Kangus?

After running that particular instance, what do you think would be an ideal group makeup there?

 

[Angus_Og]

Right now both of mine are keyed for Coilfang. Need more runs through the others to get keyed

 

[Kagnus]

Righto, this is partially why I am wondering how people think they will survive karaz.

From my understanding, these heroics require a good deal of dps. Having multiple or a couple tanks might not work, as it is a loss in dps. Anyway, congrats to you and your group for going in.

In slave Pens, there are the two defenders guarding the hallway that leads to the first boss. One of our wipes was on them because we found out they are not sheepable nor ice-trapable. And they hit tanks for up to 4k. At first (after finding out cc did not work) Tinie tried to tank both, but two of them just hit too fast and too hard for a healer to keep up.

After our wipe, I tanked one (the first dps target) and Tinie tanked the other while the first one was dealt with. Tinie died just as the one I tanked was killed, and I quickly taunted her target and tanked it for a bit and then died as well. Luckily, by the time I died it was low enough in health that ranged dps took it out.

I don't think two full tanks are necessary, but a hybrid class that can switch roles when needed is invaluable, imo. In the situation above, we needed two tanks. While Kagnus is prot spec'd, I do have dps gear/weapons for him, as well as a full healing set. I took the role as secondary healer on the boss fight.

I think the 5 of us that went in also were about as well geared as could be with non-heroic/non-karazhan gear.

 

[Daire]

You went with a:
frost mage
(i forget what class you said you were playing lol)
prot warrior
and supafly healer (priest)
and what else, a rogue?

Frost mages are not really putting out enough dps imho, but if they like playing frost, super!

Most def. a hybrid class would be great for anything. Im wondering if a druid could tank those two mobs your talking about more easily than a warrior. since druids have the armor and health multiplier? I mean, yeah it would still be some huge hits and the healer would have to be on their feet.

Atleast you guys gave it a shot! Im hoping to hit one tonight. Our apt. currently smells like paint fumes realllllllllllly bad so im not sure when we will be back in the apartment.

 

[Kagnus]

Sounds like both tanks and dps need to be on their toes. And everyone needs to play smart. You can't go dps crazy right from the start. It also sounds like every single bit of threat generation is going to be needed from tanks to hold aggro, so that's another reason I may go protection specced for defiance. (to name just one)

This is so very true. If dps pulls aggro and gets hit, they will either die right off, or add unnecessary healing load to the healer.

On regular trash mobs? Were you able to heal yourself a bit on Kangus?

Yes on reg trash mobs, yes I was, and I did. The tandem taunting was not needed 100% of the time, but occasionally, Tinie's health would get near critical while our healer was in the middle of a heal, so I would taunt to insure that she stayed alive, and when she was at full health she would taunt back.

After running that particular instance, what do you think would be an ideal group makeup there?

First would be smart players, chaotic fights are not allowed.

However, CC is essential. So a mage for sure, as being able to resheep during the fights is big. And a hunter for the ice traps, and one that knows how to retrap without getting into melee range. A very well geared tank that is able to watch every mob and catch them if they do something unexpected. And then a hybrid that can add dps when needed, tank when needed, or heal when needed. And an excellent healing-spec'd healer.

If a rogue imp sap is used for CC, there needs to be enough DPS to take out the first target before sap breaks, and if sap fades or breaks early before the first is dealt with, then you will need an off-tank to catch that one.

I am sure there are other group makeups that would work. Really you need players that know their class and know how to play smart.

 

[Kagnus]

You went with a:
frost mage
(i forget what class you said you were playing lol)
prot warrior
and supafly healer (priest)
and what else, a rogue?

Prot warrior, prot paladin, frost mage, marksman hunter and a holy priest.

Frost mages are not really putting out enough dps imho, but if they like playing frost, super!

Actually, the improved slowing effects of a frost mage help immensely in keeping encounters non-chaotic. And Zennen has enough gear to put out a good amount of damage.

Most def. a hybrid class would be great for anything. Im wondering if a druid could tank those two mobs your talking about more easily than a warrior. since druids have the armor and health multiplier? I mean, yeah it would still be some huge hits and the healer would have to be on their feet.

I plan to run my next heroic on Azolas, so I will let you know how a feral druid does

 

[Daire]

Awesome

 

[Artwin]

Artwin is Keyed for Coilfang, auch and Hellfire so I am up for any Heroics at any time...I have also run herioc Ramparts once upto where the first should be.....The mobs do hit hard but are managable with good grps like this guild is able to put together....Aggro is a big worry for anyone going in there but Herioc Ramparts is(what I found) easy still just healers need to stay on their toes and tanks do as well....

 

[Xandar]

Ok, I have run a few Heroic's now, and found that I enjoy them. It is much more of a tactical challenge than the normal run through. My longer ice trap has proved invaluable through the runs. I librally apply a Wyvern sting as well, which takes the mob out of action for 12 sec, but then dots them up, so this mob needs to be high on the take out list.

Yes, we die more than we are used to, but it usually takes 2 mistakes, not just one to wipe. The bosses really aren't much more of a challenge than regular, its the trash mobs which get to you.

The average mob drops about 12 silver per, to as long as there aren't TOO many deaths, the repair cost is pretty much covered. I have seen a lot more blues and such from the chests and trash mobs so this is nice also.

 

[example42]

The bosses really aren't much more of a challenge than regular, its the trash mobs which get to you.

This varies wildly by instance and even within instances. For example, the first boss of Steamvaults is super-hard, the second boss is not much better, but the final boss is not any harder than non-heroic. Durnholde used to be the same way. The first boss was almost impossible. (Though I believe they have tuned this since last time I was there.) I suspect we will see a lot more tuning of heroic bosses over the next couple of months. Especially with the elixir nerfs.