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I got couple questions. I have some problems here since it was me and exo who sort of started it (or me solo if u wanna put it that way).
I believe ToJ was a Community, excepting all Christian gamers of any age, any gender, and in any part of the world, despite the fact whetehr you were in it or not. I have been feeling less welcomed in ToJ, particularly CS section ever since i joined FLS, and moved on to Team-3R. If you guys are planning to make ToJ seperate, and disallow multi clanning along with ToJ, I'm assuming yuo guys are going to kick all team-3r members who are partially joined with ToJ. I won't stand against it, but if u guys ARE doing it, I hope u guys are doing it equally amonst those who are in Team.awe, knowing many of them are in ToJ as well.
Fine we did recruit from ToJ, but we didn't force them or anything. We didn't steal them away, and we still allowed free taggin of [ToJ.cc] when they please. We did not force them to join our team, and we let few of them go already due to the incidence in server. I think it should be judged fairly.
I'm sorry to say this, but on behalf of Team-3R, If i am being kicked from ToJ server, i will be resigning my StarCraft chapter leader position as well. I hope to be staying in ToJ for longer, but i cannot fore see the future.
-FlashoN
I believe ToJ was a Community, excepting all Christian gamers of any age, any gender, and in any part of the world, despite the fact whetehr you were in it or not. I have been feeling less welcomed in ToJ, particularly CS section ever since i joined FLS, and moved on to Team-3R. If you guys are planning to make ToJ seperate, and disallow multi clanning along with ToJ, I'm assuming yuo guys are going to kick all team-3r members who are partially joined with ToJ. I won't stand against it, but if u guys ARE doing it, I hope u guys are doing it equally amonst those who are in Team.awe, knowing many of them are in ToJ as well.
Fine we did recruit from ToJ, but we didn't force them or anything. We didn't steal them away, and we still allowed free taggin of [ToJ.cc] when they please. We did not force them to join our team, and we let few of them go already due to the incidence in server. I think it should be judged fairly.
I'm sorry to say this, but on behalf of Team-3R, If i am being kicked from ToJ server, i will be resigning my StarCraft chapter leader position as well. I hope to be staying in ToJ for longer, but i cannot fore see the future.
-FlashoN
Thaddius
Member
Sorry Van, I never saw your questions. Maybe you were dead and I was alive. As for IRC, I don't hang out there much. I'll meet with everyone involved and discuss it. I'm game for that.
Flash,
No one is being kicked out of ToJ. This discussion was something that bearly got started and blown way out. Nothing had happened at all and now we are kicking people out. I must have missed that memo. The problem with people flying off half cocked is that it leads to stuff like this. Assumptions are made and people get upset over stuff they think might happen. Nothing has happened, nothing has changed. ToJ has not changed in its membership policy. Relax.
Cory
Flash,
No one is being kicked out of ToJ. This discussion was something that bearly got started and blown way out. Nothing had happened at all and now we are kicking people out. I must have missed that memo. The problem with people flying off half cocked is that it leads to stuff like this. Assumptions are made and people get upset over stuff they think might happen. Nothing has happened, nothing has changed. ToJ has not changed in its membership policy. Relax.
Cory
EspressoMachine
New Member
wow. I was there, and I'm not jumping in this thing to argue, only to state what I feel needs to be stated, without regard to the chain of events that led to this scenario. Guys, we need to speak the truth *in love*. It breaks my heart to come to the forums and see this kind of thing happening. Not the disagreement, that happens, as we can never agree on everything. But we really need to be careful what we say and how we say it. Especially in this type of forum environment, where you typically have never met the person and the tone of your words can not be measured. The typed word is a cold, cold thing, and I fear many times, we do nothing to warm it up.
It grieves my spirit to see this type of arguing in our community. We are to sharpen each other as iron sharpens iron, not as a pencil sharpener sharpens a pencil. Please, please, please, before you post, read and reread what you are writing, pray about it (before you even start typing), and make sure you're doing it for the right reasons, not just to defend your name or point out someone else's shortcomings. I've been around and I've seen Satan use this tactic so many times, because it works. Divide and conquer...it's basic military strategy. We are much easier to bring down if we are broken into small groups, particularly if we start fighting against each other. Then we're doing his job for him in trying to conquer each other. And nothing of Kingdom value is gained from it. Nothing.
I'm not saying noone should ever be called out when they behave inappropriately, etc... Just that when we do it, we do it for the right reasons and we do it properly. When you get right down to it, it's a matter of the heart. We need to pray that God would give us grace for each other and an honest desire to see each other grow (which does involve pruning and sometimes...many times...pain) that it is rooted in our love for one another, which needs to be rooted itself, first and foremost in the love of God.
Please don't take any of this as condemnation, and know that I certainly don't consider myself above any of you. I just felt compelled in the Spirit to address this issue before it gets out of hand and we have as many Christian gaming communities as we do denominations.
Peace,
Espresso
It grieves my spirit to see this type of arguing in our community. We are to sharpen each other as iron sharpens iron, not as a pencil sharpener sharpens a pencil. Please, please, please, before you post, read and reread what you are writing, pray about it (before you even start typing), and make sure you're doing it for the right reasons, not just to defend your name or point out someone else's shortcomings. I've been around and I've seen Satan use this tactic so many times, because it works. Divide and conquer...it's basic military strategy. We are much easier to bring down if we are broken into small groups, particularly if we start fighting against each other. Then we're doing his job for him in trying to conquer each other. And nothing of Kingdom value is gained from it. Nothing.
I'm not saying noone should ever be called out when they behave inappropriately, etc... Just that when we do it, we do it for the right reasons and we do it properly. When you get right down to it, it's a matter of the heart. We need to pray that God would give us grace for each other and an honest desire to see each other grow (which does involve pruning and sometimes...many times...pain) that it is rooted in our love for one another, which needs to be rooted itself, first and foremost in the love of God.
Please don't take any of this as condemnation, and know that I certainly don't consider myself above any of you. I just felt compelled in the Spirit to address this issue before it gets out of hand and we have as many Christian gaming communities as we do denominations.
Peace,
Espresso
Kaiine
New Member
Van,[b said:
I believe my comments are straight. Maybe you misinterpreted them. I know you are a sensible person. Feel free to discuss anything on the forums, but when it comes down to topics as sensitive as this one, then I'd rather have a private discussion.
What Espresso wrote is exactly what I want to avoid. Now, everyone is going to comment on this and who knows what other new members are thinking right now - the discord, the dissension among members, the sharp comments. This is pathetic, and this is not the place to do it. We can accomodoate just about anything private these days.
Kaiine
New Member
Oh, and as far as Booyah - what's done is done. I am not judging him, I simply do not feel the need to get to know him at this point. He's been banned, and I'm sure for good reasons. This isn't the only incident we've faced with him, and we've actually had to delete a thread in this forum because of him.
That's all I can say.
That's all I can say.
I have two thoughts on this:
One, this is an issue you and yours are making public by banning us and expelling Booyah, and I will keep it public from here on out, simply because I feel we all have the right to comment on this situation.
Two -- Perhaps it should be made private, simply for the sake of the community on a whole, though I do feel it would be unfair to us, seeing how the higher-ups would have the leverage, the power, and we would be required to submit to whatever they propose, if we wanted to remain in ToJ.
It's a tough choice, and I'd much prefer the former.
Van
One, this is an issue you and yours are making public by banning us and expelling Booyah, and I will keep it public from here on out, simply because I feel we all have the right to comment on this situation.
Two -- Perhaps it should be made private, simply for the sake of the community on a whole, though I do feel it would be unfair to us, seeing how the higher-ups would have the leverage, the power, and we would be required to submit to whatever they propose, if we wanted to remain in ToJ.
It's a tough choice, and I'd much prefer the former.
Van
Kaiine
New Member
Van, you are basically calling us liars, and blaming us of concealing secrets and hiding pertinent info from the members. I will NOT tolerate this. I am actually downright upset at your accusations.
Please do not keep doing this.
Please do not keep doing this.
Kaiine
New Member
Ahhh! This is getting messy!
I am not sure how one would go about kicking/banning a person without it being public? However, we can discuss these issues in private!
I am not sure how one would go about kicking/banning a person without it being public? However, we can discuss these issues in private!
<_>
I refuse to talk about it anymore, just message me or call me or SOMETHING like that if you really wish to discuss it. I'm temporarily banning myself from the forums =]
I'll leave it up to Elite, since he's the current person I'm speaking with about this to lift my own ban off me. ^,^
Van
I refuse to talk about it anymore, just message me or call me or SOMETHING like that if you really wish to discuss it. I'm temporarily banning myself from the forums =]
I'll leave it up to Elite, since he's the current person I'm speaking with about this to lift my own ban off me. ^,^
Van
i would have to say that recently admins have been a little quick to ban/kick from the server. last week plank banned dijon without a kick/warning for "hacking" when i was specing and clearly he was not. he was just that much better then the people on the server at that point in time. note: he was useing a different name and i only learned it was him after he complained in #t.awe when i was alt tabing in and out of the game. he was simply awping out of dd on aztec (ct side) and got i think 4 kills in quick succession. just somthing that i saw while on the server...
LionOfJudah
Member, Dreamcast Fishing Guru
Send me the condumps unaltered. if you are a member and have the condump from the night in question please send it. Admins if you do send it. Elite can you send the Log if possible.
Van you know me, you know that i am active on the forums. If you are concerned about it, i will personally put myself at the disposal of the admins/offended to mediate and talk to them both.
I have great respect for Kidan/the admins. Also van we may disagree at times but that will not cloud what i would think of you as a Christian.
Straight up guys we know the rules some people have told me that i am too stiff on them. the reason i am stiff is to avoid this stuff. Take it to the forums if you want to discuss it. Leave counter-strike to be a game not a debate forum.
Van you know me, you know that i am active on the forums. If you are concerned about it, i will personally put myself at the disposal of the admins/offended to mediate and talk to them both.
I have great respect for Kidan/the admins. Also van we may disagree at times but that will not cloud what i would think of you as a Christian.
Straight up guys we know the rules some people have told me that i am too stiff on them. the reason i am stiff is to avoid this stuff. Take it to the forums if you want to discuss it. Leave counter-strike to be a game not a debate forum.
Kaiine
New Member
Ok, just one reminder to everyone:
WE'RE HUMANS! We will make mistakes sometimes (not saying any of the above was simply a mistake) but, you guys gotta realize that when we are on the servers we're not just playing we're watching, waiting, listening, responding. Sometimes we get caught up in the moment, sometimes we are having a bad day (in which none of us should even be on the server when in a bad mood). Do you guys get what I'm saying?
Please be patient with us, we are trying to do the best we can for the ToJ community. We do need constructive criticism, and feedback but in a positive way. And also remember we're going to make mistakes. We'll be quick to make a decision, but we'll also be quick to apologize and stand up for what actions we've taken.
Van - I appreciate your dedication to this thread and topic and to Booyah. Very much so. I personally apologize if you've felt belittled or treated unfair, or that your requests have gone un-noticed. You wouldn't believe the amount of emails and messages with people who need this and that. I'd hate to see what the others are getting as well. We are trying to do everything we can for ToJ outside out jobs and homes.
I appreciate your patience as well.
WE'RE HUMANS! We will make mistakes sometimes (not saying any of the above was simply a mistake) but, you guys gotta realize that when we are on the servers we're not just playing we're watching, waiting, listening, responding. Sometimes we get caught up in the moment, sometimes we are having a bad day (in which none of us should even be on the server when in a bad mood). Do you guys get what I'm saying?
Please be patient with us, we are trying to do the best we can for the ToJ community. We do need constructive criticism, and feedback but in a positive way. And also remember we're going to make mistakes. We'll be quick to make a decision, but we'll also be quick to apologize and stand up for what actions we've taken.
Van - I appreciate your dedication to this thread and topic and to Booyah. Very much so. I personally apologize if you've felt belittled or treated unfair, or that your requests have gone un-noticed. You wouldn't believe the amount of emails and messages with people who need this and that. I'd hate to see what the others are getting as well. We are trying to do everything we can for ToJ outside out jobs and homes.
I appreciate your patience as well.
Kaiine
New Member
/unbans Van's ban...
Okay, don't feel like you can't talk here but I'd like to see more sensitive topics in private from now on...
Okay, don't feel like you can't talk here but I'd like to see more sensitive topics in private from now on...
I was there when Booyah and Gypsy were banned for no good reason, after which Kidan commented:
Vanaze and the others DID NOT deserve to be banned, Just some abusive arrogant can't-ever-be-wrong admins made that decision.
Some of the admins have most definetly been tyrants lately.
I believe the 3R members deserve an immediate apology, But that won't happen with the apparent arrogance of the involved admins.
I hate to see Booyah unable to play on the ToJ server,
I have much better respect for him then most all the admins.
What is this highly inappropriate hatred towards team 3R?[b said:
Exodus, I've seen the condump and it only makes you look bad trying to deny it.[b said:
Vanaze and the others DID NOT deserve to be banned, Just some abusive arrogant can't-ever-be-wrong admins made that decision.
Some of the admins have most definetly been tyrants lately.
I believe the 3R members deserve an immediate apology, But that won't happen with the apparent arrogance of the involved admins.
I hate to see Booyah unable to play on the ToJ server,
I have much better respect for him then most all the admins.
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