For 700B, you too can go to a luxury resort...

nattyg

nattyg

New Member
Spending 2 nights writing about 50 pages that boil down to "we always do it this way because it works and we're good at what we do" - $3000

Room Service while writing such a paper for 2 nights - $50

Watching Drudge Report pop up this little gem after seeing the market tank yet another day...priceless.
 
yeah that finally made the Mainstream press..:) When gov't money is involved the amount of waste always skyrockets.
 
I think the recent bubble explosion shows it doesn't matter whose money is on the table...As long as it doesn't belong to them, they will waste it.
 
nattyg said:
Watching Drudge Report pop up this little gem after seeing the market tank yet another day...priceless.
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I would like to say I'm surprised, but this only confirms (as if we needed any more evidence after the bailout) that the United States is an oligarchy masquerading as a republic.

I love America and I'm blessed to be able to worship freely without fear of religious persecution, but human nature is human nature and greed is a constant. I still believe America is one of the best places in the world to live, but it's not without its flaws.

I'm hoping the bailout will expose America as an oligarchy and enough people will get angry and get involved to make a difference, but I predict that as soon as the majority of people are financially comfortable, they'll have a sudden fit of amnesia.
 
Yer it sounds like alot but how many ppl were there and how long did they stay for. I am not one for supporting corporate greed but if I had to go away from my family for some compulsory fun time (aka corporate retreat) I would want to know i would be getting at least a few perks from it. Yer I don't know...depends on the circumstances as to how bad it was.
 
Yer true enough.. I mean I thought the whole point of Capatalism was that if you stuffed up and didn't run your business right you closed down. That is supposed to be the way we ensure that business as a whole is useing resources in the most effective manner. But having said that if businesses dramatically reduced spending money we would be in a lot worse shape than we are now. Part of the recovery is that both people and businesses need to feel confident that than can spend money. I mean they need to not only survive but thrive for it to all be worthwhile. There is not much use for businesses to sit around with sack cloth and ashes for getting stung by what almost every other financial institution has been stung by.
 
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nattyg said:
yeah...when YOU and your company are responsible for draining 85b...oh, and you go and get another 35 from state gvt then you probably shouldn't be having corporate retreats
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Imagine the advertising campaign for St. Regis Resort in Monarch Beach:

"Mr. CEO, you've just flushed the American economy down the toilet and blackmailed Congress into using taxpayer money to covering your greed and stupidity. What are you going to do next?"

"I'm going to St. Regis Resort in Monarch Beach!"
 
The other thing to note is that the corporate greed of the CEOs is simply a reflection of the greed of us all. Indeed, all of us, business, governement, shareholder, and consumer, are at least in part responsible for the whole predicament that we are in now.

Why did CEOs of financial corporations take on bad loans? Because both big and small mum and dad investors wanted more profits now not later. And how were banks able to give bad loans? Because people wanted houses and other stuff now not when they could afford it.
 
ppar3566 said:
The other thing to note is that the corporate greed of the CEOs is simply a reflection of the greed of us all. Indeed, all of us, business, governement, shareholder, and consumer, are at least in part responsible for the whole predicament that we are in now.

Why did CEOs of financial corporations take on bad loans? Because both big and small mum and dad investors wanted more profits now not later. And how were banks able to give bad loans? Because people wanted houses and other stuff now not when they could afford it.
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QFT.

It's still wrong for corporations to exploit customers, but the American public at large is not wholly innocent.
 
.....what does QFT mean. Srry my 133T-fu is weak.

Edit: yeah for wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QFT ....is this what it means?

In any case this is the sort of discussion I have recently had on other forums in CG. How do we balance holding ppl responsible for their actions when we often do similar things ourselves.. and may very well do the exact same thing if give the same circumstances? I don't know I swing from anger at their greed to shame at my own. When someone finds a way to balance this in an adaptive way be sure to let me know.
 
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There are two things that need to happen. Well, a bunch, but the two you can control:

1) Be financially responsible yourself. Taking on a mortgage to buy a home is fine. Taking on uncapped ARM loans, interest-only loans, or taking loans that are more than you can honestly pay for is bad. Create a budget and follow it. Live within your means, so to speak.

2) Vote. When the government is making bad choices, find out where your current senators, representatives, councilpersons, etc and stand on issues, how they've voted in the past. We have to show the politicians that we are going to hold them accountable for their actions. The county my mom lives in just had a major turn-over in the last election because the people were sick of the bad policies that the old administration put in place.

Yes, it takes time and effort, but if your government is left unchecked, they will continue to make bad choices as well.
 
@Kidan

I just re-read your post and Yeppers I see u are coming from. But I still think the major point stands, ppl signed the contract to take out home loans they simply could not afford. Now they may have been helped in this bad decision but ultimately it is their signiture based on their miss-management of their funds. I know this doesn't apply to everyone and makes light of the pressure ppl were under and the attractiveness of the offer but I was simply trying to say that it may be easy to blame the CEOs of big finacials but this negates the role that all sorts of sources play in contributing to this problem. It took a consolidated effort by mostly everyone in almost every single western coutry on earth to get us into the mess and like Durruck said it will take a bit of responsibility from all of us to get out of it.

@GP
I think all CEOs are greedy in the respect that we are all greedy. I think what does fail to get said is that CEOs are largely at the mercy of their shareholders who want money now and are willing to talk with their feet if they don't get it. In essence CEOs (like all of us) get stuck in our own "presinors dilemma". In other words "it would be nice to not take on bad debts and rather focus on long term profits but ABC bank down the road did and they just made $billion, gosh now I need to do it or we won't be able to compete with their dividends this finacial year and our share price will plumet and i will get fired". In the words of Nick Haraway this is how kindly old Joe next door becomes the meanist, most profit driven, greedy boss on earth (pencil neck A+).

Hopefully, this whole thing will force companies to think of long-term gain over short term gain from now on.
 
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i would say *most* shareholders are not greedy...*most* shareholders are simply people wanting a stable return on investment as they save for their 401(k) ...shareholders like Ichan might be a different story...but the illusion that shareholders are the top 5% and opulant white collared power brokers is one myth that needs to be taken down! the fact is, that *most* shareholders are people that don't look at themselves as being shareholders and simply rely on their money managers through their various investment vehicles delivering a retireable (new word??) amount.

i wholeheartedly agree that greed is at the root of this though...but from a consumer side as you said, and not really a shareholder side (institutional shareholders and managers might be an exception). people didn't manage their own finances well...didn't read the fine print..and barring fraud aren't really excused in this matter

/lesigh

i don't think companies will get over short term gain fever, particularly when "bubbles" are forming...and as much as i hate to say it...i'm almost leaning towards the side of salary regulation...maybe not regulation, but the government perhaps holding it (mainly bonuses) in trust for a period of time...particularly in industries which could reap such systemic havoc. i mean, who really cares of Dell or HP goes out of business..practically. It wouldn't be good but it wouldn't have nearly as a widespread effect on the macroeconomy.


oh...did anyone happen to notice AIG is getting ANOTHER 30B+ infusion?!?!?! WHAT IS GOING ON PEOPLES!?!?!?!
 
Tek7 said:
Imagine the advertising campaign for St. Regis Resort in Monarch Beach:

"Mr. CEO, you've just flushed the American economy down the toilet and blackmailed Congress into using taxpayer money to covering your greed and stupidity. What are you going to do next?"

"I'm going to St. Regis Resort in Monarch Beach!"
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i'm half tempted to call them and have it go something like this...

"Hello...this is...blah blah...may i help you?"

"uh, yes, i'd like to reserve a room in the name of AIG...i think they're picking up the tab for me...well, actually i'll be paying it this april...can you just charge it to them please?"
 
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