Raiding Teams - Working Draft

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Icthus

Active Member
These teams are not set in stone. This is a working document.

They will be edited often so check.

First team- Leaders: Wallawinski & Tebran
Healers: Wallawinski, Icthus, Laraptor , Lukey, Mituba
Tanks: Tebran, Meli, FJ, Lothain, Mordos, Sandric
Ranged DPS: Melko, Reco, Boozelm, Young, Boimli, Arakk, Christianna, Powderpuff,
Melee DPS: Mythblade, Cassadine, Seathra, Jaq, Proudfoot

Times: 6pm ST
Days:Wednesday (possibly), Friday (Wall Leads), Sunday(possibly), Monday (Tebran leads)

Second team- Leader: Quantam
Healers: Treebranch, Citgrad, Champoflight, Believer, Falcom
Tanks: Sazul, Mirakle, Goodwone, Joinyce
Ranged DPS: Quantam, Nevi, Jackhog, Zacchaeus, Baddwin, Foxbeast, Berzok
Melee DPS: Ironstone, Cooptroop

Times: 6pm ST
Days:Friday, Sunday, Monday


Class Requirements

Healers-
Druids and Priests- +1,000 to healing; +85 mana per 5 while casting;
Paladins(holy)- +800 healing +80 mana per 5 while casting

Tanks-
+490 defense
Health > 11,000 unbuffed (pallys > 10,000)
Dodge/Parry/Block all to at least +14% each or combined >45% (pallys >50%)

Ranged DPS:
Mage, Shadow Priest and Warlocks-+750 Spell Damage to your class of damage
Hunters- +1500 attack power & spec'd Marksmen<Beastmaster is very nice in many ways but pets get eaten in Raids at this moment>

Melee DPS-
+1100 Attack Power unbuffed
+7,500 health unbuffed

These are working numbers that are in flux. They are non-buffed numbers (no consumable or self buffs). I know the hunter numbers need work, but we simply did not have any when we made these.

Coming soon- All gem slots filled (please you can get 1g gems guys) and enchants on half your items.

We have two rather large teams at the moment. We are trying to work people into raiding. Please have patience with the guild as we attempt to find spots for everyone. There maybe times you are asked to stay behind or even step out to give others a chance.

Don't forget we are working toward 25 person raids. That will make it easier for all of us to raid together.

Recent changes in red
New team members in blue
 
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These are IMO from my raiding experience, these are what you should shoot to see on your character sheet. These are regarding stats only and not what skills are also necessary for each of the classes. These are talented but unbuffed minimums.

Healers (resto druids, holy priests, holy paladins, resto shamans):
900 healing, 240/80mp/5, 8000mp, 6000hp

Tanks:
Warriors: uncrittable @ 490 defense, 11,000 hp, 11-12k armor, 20-25% block and dodge, 15% parry, 5% +hit

sidenote: In order to push crushing blows off the table, your combined block, dodge, parry, and miss % must be equal to 100%

Paladins: uncrittable @ 490 defense, 10,000 hp, 11-12k armor, 20-25% block and dodge, 15% parry, 5% +hit

Druids: uncrittable @ 415 defense with Survival of the Fittest talent. Resilience also reduces how much defense you need at the rate of 1 resilience = 1.5 defense in relation to becoming uncrittable. 12,000 hp, 18-20k armor, 33+% dodge, 5%+hit

Caster DPS (Shadow Priest, Mage, Warlock, Elemental Shaman, Balance Druid):
700 +dmg in your primary school, 8500mp, 200/40mp/5, *****8-10% +hit minimum for boss fights.

Hunters:
1700 AP, 18+% crit, *****5-8% +hit

melee DPS:
Rogue: 1.2-1.4k AP, 20% crit, 8000hp, 8-10% +hit

Fury Warrior: 1.3-1.5k AP, 25% crit, 8000hp, *****10-14% +hit

Feral Druid: 1800 AP, 25% crit, 8000hp, *****6-8% +hit

Enhance Shaman: 1-1.1k AP, *****8-12% +hit

Retri Pally: ????

Again, these are stats only... people should know how to tank multiple adds, watch threat, conserve mana, pull, burst dmg, kite, CC, etc.
 
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Got attuned last night. Pally tank. I need to re-itemize some of my gems this weekend but outside of that I meet the minimum and with +500 healing in my non tank gear.
 
Now that the sand man is attuned...if there is a possibility of a third team I would like to be on said team. there just are not enough spaces for DPS to switch out (and there has not been enough switching IMO). Looking at the teams now...what is holding us back from making a third team?
 
I agree we are about there Beriale.

The officers have discussed a reorganization once the third Co-GL is in place which will be next week.

**However I was just notified that my Great Uncle passed away and my Dad has asked I come to the funeral in Nowata, Oklahoma. Looks like I will be out of pocket Sunday to Wednesday*
 
We are close Beriale but I am not sure we are there yet. (my opinion- Quantam makes the decisions) With new additions we now have 10 tanks. That would be 3 to a team (1 with 4) 3 tanks is like bare minimum and will cause teams to fail as we are often seeing tanks not able to play or out of town or only able to raid 1 night a week. Once we see that the 2 teams are solid and can easily clear through Opera each week then in my opinion we would be ready for a third team.

Like Icthus said, after the new GL is appointed raid teams will be redone with new min reqs and probably a few more qualifications for raiding. Yes we have a bunch of keyed people, but we are not effective like we should be for having that many. My opinion is that people are not taking it seriously and working hard to gear up from Heroics and Crafted Epics. Or they don't have the time to gear up and are hoping that a Kara key will take them from green/blue to purple.

I am not pointing fingers just saying that three teams is probably still a ways off and in the meantime there is gold to be farmed to afford those crafted epics! Cmon raiders...gems in every socket, enchants on all your items!! step it up friends! Do you want to be successful?

EDIT: and yes Icthus I do love my brothers and sisters and want them to see great success from raiding not burnout from never getting anywhere!
 
Are we crossing the line then from we want everyone to have a chance to see end game raids into "people are not taking it seriously?".

I see Melko and Nevi being the mages taken in for almost every run with the occasional visit by powderpuff. Where is the rotation that was promised? I have seen Kara twice and only one boss drop. I asked to be left out because I think people are wanting to get things cleared and you cannot do that if you keep shuffling members in and out. This does not mean that I don't want to raid and see this stuff!

Personally I am wearing three purples and the rest are level 70 blues. I am at 797 spell damage and 11k mana...but I don't get a chance to participate. Sure I am good enough to help people get their key fragments left and right but was not good enough to be cycled in for a chance.

Again that is all well and good but, how many people are out there waiting for their shot that have paid their dues, earned their gear and want to raid like everyone else?

I am not the only one who feels this way as previous posts by SamJ and Goblit have stated. This is where the frustration has set in. Perhaps I should just take the role that I have and continue to assist others to get there and maybe one day we will have enough to get everyone a chance to see this content.

Perhaps if the raid time was moved or there was a day where we east coaster people might have more time to play and not starting at 9 or 10pm on work nights. Or we start looking into (like we did with MC) starting a cooperative team with another guild? Keep our teams in play but those of us who don't get to go...might get the opportunity.
 
I have faith that the uber leaders in Redeemed will find a way to make us all happy! Everyone can get involved and start events for everyone to be involved in. ONY ftw!
 
You have a little something on your nose Gobby. LOL

I am not saying that I don't have faith in the leaders....just a little frustrated. I try not to post unless I am adding to a funny thread or if I have something serious to put on the table and yes I am known as a trouble maker but I am not trying to stir the pot (as it were). Just being a little vocal and wanting to engage in some candid conversation about raiding. I am not in on any of the loops so this is how I get my information.
 
with the occasional visit by powderpuff.
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PP still does not meet the stated min requirements but yet he has been in Kara enough to get a piece of Tier4 and another epic. He is again on the list tonight. I think this is an example of being quite fair in trying to get people in.
I asked to be left out because I think people are wanting to get things cleared and you cannot do that if you keep shuffling members in and out.
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I thought you asked to be left out because you said you wanted to be part of the PvP team? You are right that shuffling ppl in and out hurts progression, but yet we try to do it as much as seems viable. Another example of the RLs trying to accommodate ;)

Are we crossing the line then from we want everyone to have a chance to see end game raids into "people are not taking it seriously?".
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I clearly said that this was my opinion as a reason why we are not being that successful...I am not a raid leader just a raider giving an opinion.
 
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Beriale said:
Are we crossing the line then from we want everyone to have a chance to see end game raids into "people are not taking it seriously?".

I see Melko and Nevi being the mages taken in for almost every run with the occasional visit by powderpuff. Where is the rotation that was promised? I have seen Kara twice and only one boss drop. I asked to be left out because I think people are wanting to get things cleared and you cannot do that if you keep shuffling members in and out. This does not mean that I don't want to raid and see this stuff!

Personally I am wearing three purples and the rest are level 70 blues. I am at 797 spell damage and 11k mana...but I don't get a chance to participate. Sure I am good enough to help people get their key fragments left and right but was not good enough to be cycled in for a chance.

Again that is all well and good but, how many people are out there waiting for their shot that have paid their dues, earned their gear and want to raid like everyone else?

I am not the only one who feels this way as previous posts by SamJ and Goblit have stated. This is where the frustration has set in. Perhaps I should just take the role that I have and continue to assist others to get there and maybe one day we will have enough to get everyone a chance to see this content.

Perhaps if the raid time was moved or there was a day where we east coaster people might have more time to play and not starting at 9 or 10pm on work nights. Or we start looking into (like we did with MC) starting a cooperative team with another guild? Keep our teams in play but those of us who don't get to go...might get the opportunity.
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I want to speak directly to this...

First Beriale, since you were a part of the MC team you know the incredible frustration and many issues that developed over MC. In particular the issues around downing Major Domo and how that effected everyone on the raids. I dare say it became very unhealthy. We want to aviod that by not "throwing green bodies" at the issue. Rather, it seems prudent to raise the level of requirements and ensure qualilty teams go into the instance with the chance of sucess.

Second, if karazhan is the only raiding someone is interested in then we have all missed the boat. There is a thread in general asking the general guild what they would like to see done. We are attempting to get really good input from everyone.

Third the issue of having the right to get into Karazhan, we have set up teams with tanks, healers and leaders and have really only found a few times that everyone can go. I am sorry it does not meet your personal ability to go. We hope to possibly work some more things out.

Fourth, frustration? I think we all know frustration. How do you think the leaders of team 1 feel not being able to get past the third boss, while team 2 blows thru to the 5th or 6th? Is it fair to break up that team and make them work with the other? Frustrations definately stems from people seeing things as unfair. However, fairness depends heavy on view.

Fifth, we have had a few issues that need attention over the raiding. It is more important to have a Co-GL in place who is responsible for raiding. This must come first then we can address the other issues.

I think I personally want to say, I hear the issues that are being brought up. I have asked before and continue to ask for patience and peace as we work thru the issues. There are many, mostly that karazhan is way harder to work out than any other raid (only 10 people so everyone has to be top notch gear, enchants, and gems).

There are plans in the works to do more organization of raids, PvP, Heroic, End Game and non-BC. We are looking at more fellowship events and more raiding events. That would be the reason for the thread in general.

I can tell you, I expect to see some big changes in raiding due to that thread and the additions of people to our raiding teams.

We have an incredibly talented and healthy guild. God will direct us and work it out if we continue to communicate in positive and honesty ways.

I hope noone takes this a personal attack on anyone. It is not meant to be. It is simply a direct response to a few issues brought up.
 
The how about a few options:

1.) I would like to offer my services to those who still need their key. Any part of that chain...if you need a mage feel free to hit me up. I would like to see everyone able to make this happen.

2.) heroics: Again I would like to offer my services to any and all these instances...you need a mage...hit me up and I will run with you.

3.) getting rep: Short on Rep? I will be glad to run any and all instances for reputation and getting your keys to run heroic. I need a few myself but will run them all.

4.) help in general: Got a quest that needs some extra fire power...call on me I want to help.


Now to address the comment's above.

Mirakle...I thought you asked to be left out because you said you wanted to be part of the PvP team?....This is true, this is also after my getting placed on a team and hardly ever getting to go on these runs. I left because I saw so many people lined up to go and what possible good could it do for me to take a spot and be rotated in maybe once a month?

Icthus...since you were a part of the MC team you know the incredible frustration and many issues that developed over MC. In particular the issues around downing Major Domo and how that effected everyone on the raids...I am aware of those issues and was one of the people on team 1 and know how it feels to not get past a particular boss. In my case....I have only seen one boss drop from the two runs in that team. It takes seasoned people to run an instance and I understand the need to get people through it all and progression needs to be made. It is difficult and is why I am willing to make the effort to assist people to get attuned or keyed.

Perhaps others will follow my lead and we can organize some runs? (e.g. BM)

The thread was placed to encourage people to run heroic instances to get better gear and I totally agree...let's step up and assist people to get geared and get them into the 10 man's so perhaps one day we can tackle the 25 man or maybe two teams to do 25 mans.

This and I am also trying to find my place in the guild. I feel a bit lost in the masses and not serving a purpose. So there is another piece of my frustration.

No offense taken and I intend none myself.

Much love for all my redeemed brothers and sisters.
 
Heroics are another issue too, there is a small handful of guildies able to do heroics and a lot seem to hardly ever want to help with anything other than that. Everyone acts like its easy to get groups for shattered halls etc, I spent one afternoon over 3 hours straight asking in guild, TE chat, general chat in hellfire, trade chat in shatt and in the LFG system the whole time and never got a group for shattered halls, Where ended up 1 SH run from exhalted:( I think DPS in general wow is overpopulated just like it is in guild and it is getting harder and harder to find groups for things if you arent a tank or healer or arent in with some heh.
 
Well with the pally yeah, but I have been passed over by groups doing heroics for Pally healers and I am sitting at +1600 healing 160 mana per 5 but I wear tissue paper or armor.
 
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