lurker analysis

darksorrow

darksorrow

Member
post here how you died for each attempt, if you can remember the previous attempts that would be nice too.

Friday:
attempt 1: MT did not receive heals, wipe
attempt 2: MT did not receive heals, wipe

Monday:
attempt 1: MT did not receive heals, wipe
attempt 2: failed to solo heal MT after the transition, wipe
attempt 3: Guardian at my spot didn't get a cc fast enough, wheretoo started tanking, I failed to solo heal wheretoo, wheretoo dies, I died afterwards.



everyone who went to the raid for lurker post here, and I can do a statistic analysis on the main reasons we died and figure out what we are doing wrong. main reason i want to do this is because in a fight like lurker, there is really no reason for us to die whatsoever, so when someone dies, it should only happen after the MT has died. I'm thinking whirlwind is affecting the raid more than we thought it was.
 
I was there, and I can tell ya, that whirl wind wreaked havoc on me, or it seemed to. Stand at the front, get knocked into the water. No big deal but as I jump out of the water, I'm knocked 20 yards away and I'm dead, I really can't tank 10k in damage that fast. If I stand at the back of the inner circle, I'm fine until Sazul goes out of LOS and I have to move up to heal him, then I get knocked back and I think you know the rest of the story.

Having to jump in the water during spout is no big deal for me. Down I go, renew myself, watch wait, hop back up, reaquire tank as target if necessary, deal with whirlwind knock backs, you know the rest of the story.
 
avoid whirlwind = group with a shadow priest, ask for underwater breathing.

im curious if melee gets hit by whirlwind while underwater, if not, we can have the entire raid go underwater except the people on the islands. transition from phase 1 to phase 2 should be very simple.
 
One thing I just noticed is, the Lurker actually has 2 knockbacks, Whirl and Geyser. Both of them *can* hit you underwater (but will only deal damage, not knock back). That said, it seems you would be placing a heavy burden on the healers. (Fortunately, this fight doesn't have a shot clock, so as long as the DPS is still enough to get the adds down, you can bring extra.)

And I really wish they'd label the vids by spec as well as class--there is, as you can imagine, a huge difference in the case of certain classes.
 
geyser is when no one is in melee range, which means the MT probably died already. I've also noticed most guilds can finish all the adds and have around 10 seconds of free time just standing there waiting for lurker to come up, i'm wondering what's causing us to not be able to finish the adds on time.
 
lacking dps? i just did Lurker with my guild and the set-up is the same as Redeemed....range on outside island and melee inside. We down the adds and still have 7 secs to spare. Down the MT add 1st and work ur way around.
 
I talked to Cucillo about this today and foebane kept wiping and wiping on this guy because of the adds. The first time they downed him they changed up the strat...They had 2 mages in the group and these mages kept 2 of the Guardians in the center ring sheeped the whole fight....once they started resisting sheep 2 locks would chain fear them.

The point why they ended up downing the boss is because they only had to deal with 7 adds instead of 9 the whole fight since 2were CC'd the whole time. If the adds are not taken down by the time Lurker dives again then they just dont respawn.

Since trying this strat they have used it since and have never wiped on Lurker again.

Thoughts?
 
The way guild I was in downed Lurker is a Little different than the way we do it. Once we started doing this way Lurker became way easy.

First on the outer Islands we only had 1 Toon either a warlock or a Hunter. They would Fear or Ice trap the outer islands. Mages on the inner ring would sheep the other mobs on the outer island. The DPS then would kill the middle island. While the dps is dealing with the middle island the warlock on the outer island would start dealling with his mobs and. Killing them off after the middle island is dealt with the dps would finish off the outer islands.

Some people will ask about threat. This is not a Speed fight at first. you just need to hold off for a little bit.

All range DPS and Healers that are not on the little islands stand on the outer edge of the middle ring. All Melee stand on the inner edge. Everyone spreads out so that they do get the ice knock back.

This way you knock down all the mobs and get the ones on the main island first because they hit HARD.

Also we need to put some water between the spawns and the mages so that the spawns will not land and just eat the mages.
 
Sazul said:
I talked to Cucillo about this today and foebane kept wiping and wiping on this guy because of the adds. The first time they downed him they changed up the strat...They had 2 mages in the group and these mages kept 2 of the Guardians in the center ring sheeped the whole fight....once they started resisting sheep 2 locks would chain fear them.

The point why they ended up downing the boss is because they only had to deal with 7 adds instead of 9 the whole fight since 2were CC'd the whole time. If the adds are not taken down by the time Lurker dives again then they just dont respawn.

Since trying this strat they have used it since and have never wiped on Lurker again.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...

Permasheep sounds fun...I'll bring extra wool Mon
 
i kept dieing because i didnt recieve any heals, the healers were too busy jumping off of the bridge... ;;>.>
 
As long as the mele hitlikeatuck mobs are CC'd or killed in the middle we should have it!
 
Illyria: you're thinking of waterbolt. Geyser is a random one (can hit anyone but the MT) , the one that hits a small area around its target (BY WATER BE PURGED!) Water Bolt is the one he does if no one's around.
 
which is why we need more healers. that night we dont have enough healers, since 3 healers were not specced for healing. geyser has a small aoe too, so standing near each other is not such a good idea. most videos I saw, there were only 2 people standing on each island, everyone else is on the big island. geyser will definitely knock you into water, so you might be out of range of heals, bring health pots and bandages, we got 2 healthstones and they dont share cooldown with pots, that should cover the damage.
 
I thought yesterdays attempts were much better.

I am not sure if putting the tank and two healers in the water is working out as expected. Because of LOS issues, especially after a whirlwind knockback. On one attempt, CSAltoid was under 1k health and I spent 3 seconds looking for him because of LOS and Sazul died during that time. I suspect all the other healers had the same issue and thats why Sazul died.

This fight honestly seem like a Rag fight with only the addition of spout, where everybody has to get into the water.

I'm going to add my two cents if I may, only because everybody else has (wink wink).

It appears that the island is set up in such away that there is a natural tanking spot with a wall behind it, other then knowing how to position ones self, it seems pretty straight forward. Why not take advantage of it instead of having sazul in the water and two pally healers.

Just as lurker starts to whirl, Sazul walks forward into the water, swimming on the surface. When he is knocked back, he should be just knocked back onto the platform, its only a 5 yard knock back. Have the OT walk to the back of the inner circle out of the mellee range so they don't get knocked back but ready to bounce in if Sazul is knocked out of mellee range.

Mellee pallies and rogues should also get to the back of the inner circle out of mellee range as well. Boss mods gives a count down timer to whirl, step back with 2 seconds to whirl. Then go back in. We did this on Rag, all our rogues have been to dozens on dozens of rag fights.

Spout: You don't need boss mods for spout, blizzards UI puts in big white lettering "Lurker takes a deep breath" in the middle of your screen. When you see it, step into the water, press X once (if you didn't bind it to something else). Pressing X once puts you under the water enough so you don't get knocked back. While you are under the water, continue attacking. When the spout passes you by, hop back on land and bandage yourselves. Spout happens every 45 to 60 seconds so most times (between which we have to deal with adds) so the "recently bandaged debuff" should be off you by the next time you need it.

The geyser has a small attack radius of 3 yards around the player attacked (much smaller then rags ranged knock back). It is frost damage (is there frost protection elixers?). And it only goes after those in ranged, not in mellee. So people on the inner island should always be in mellee excpet during whirlwind and they will never be geysered. If the three outer islands can position themselves to be 3 yards apart that would be great but not always practical. Hunters with longer range can be on the back end of the islands. A death and taxes video of lurker I watched, the ranged used Greater Frost protection potions.
 
There were actually three pallies in the water. The same problem that exists for you guys on the island exists for us in the water where we have LOS issues on almost everyone above water even though Grid says they are in range. Other then the one time CSAltoid took that big hit, being underwater was not much of an issue. I think that instance was more of a positioning issue and something the other healers can work on. Just ignore the pink pallies on grid as you probably can't heal them anyways and focus on the tank and above ground targets. Pallies underwater should be the only ones worrying about the pallies. Between our bubble, LoH, potions and our own heals the other healers should not have to focus on us. Something to work on next time is maybe designating a "pally" pally healer while underwater. Since we had three of them, I could have easily been the designated pally healer when they got in trouble so that way there would not be a loss of focus on the MT.

The question is having three healers underwater put to much strain on the healers above water and the larger number of raiders they have to keep alive?

Crushes on the MT appeared to be an issue a couple of times too. Damage typically doesn't kill a tank but spikes in damage do. No tank is crush immune but tankadin's Improved Holy Shield mechanics allow them to be more crush immune than an equally geared warrior using Improved Shield Block. It is a trade off. Better threat/spike damage mitigation/one less healer vs better overall mitigation/1k more health/damage debuffs.
 
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