Kagnus
New Member
This thread is not specific to a class, but it does help understand certain classes better (I hope)
I thought it would be a good idea to post a reference for us in The Forgiven on how melee damage is handled in the game for those who should be most accustomed to it, mainly tank classes. This thread was sparked by a question we had in Karazhan while fighting maiden:
"What is a crushing blow?"
While it would be simple to focus on just that question, I think if not placed in context with all the other factors, the importance of what it is can be lost. Also, those who like to research info can find this info out, but there are others who may not want to dig around the WoW forums and the internet to fit the pieces together to understand their tanking class better. So this is a thread for The Forgiven to discuss such technical things, because in the end it helps reduce frustration when dealing with content that is not so forgiving
Lets first take a look at what happens on each melee swing. This is the sequence that a melee swing is evaluated against -
Does the swing miss? If not then ...
Does the swing get dodged? If not then ...
Does the swing get parried? If not then ...
Does the swing get blocked? If not then ...
Does the swing critically hit? If not then ...
Does the swing crush? If not then ...
The swing becomes a normal hit.
So we have the following sequence to consider for each melee swing and what it means to the one being hit -
Miss - 100% damage avoidance
Dodge - 100% damage avoidance
Parry - 100% damage avoidance
Block - 100% damage minus damage mitigated by shield block value, shield block rating, strength, armor value, buff and debuffs.
Critical Hit - 200% damage minus passive mitigation (armor value, buffs/debuffs affecting damage taken, etc)
Crushing Hit - 150% damage minus passive mitigation (armor value, buffs/debuffs affecting damage taken, etc)
* Important to know: a crush can only occur if the mob hitting you is 3 or more level above your level.
Normal Hit - 100% damage minus passive mitigation (armor value, buffs/debuffs affecting damage taken, etc)
So why focus on crushes? They are not as bad as criticals, what's the big deal?
Tank classes have 100% control on if they get critically hit or not through gear. Crushing blows, however, can only be 100% avoided by closing the level gap. And in most content, particularly "end game" where the content is on par of the level cap, closing the level gap does not become an option.
However, there is a way to become "uncrushable" (except for druids) through some gearing factors and how the tank actively manages the encounter. The way to do this is to get it so your Dodge, Parry and Block percentages have over a 100% chance to mitigate the incoming hit. This is figured out by simply adding the percentages together.
So, as a tank, if you have the following
Dodge - 20%
Parry - 15%
Block - 15%
You have a 50% chance to avoid a crushing blow. Considering that against bosses that are ?? level (meaning that for the level of the content, they are most certainly more than 3 levels above you) you only have a 50/50 chance of avoiding a chance at a crush (remember, for most tanks, gear and talents push being crit off the table).
So, for warriors and paladins during a fight, you have active abilities that can possibly push crushes off the table and make you "uncrushable" in a way like how defense rating can make you "uncritable".
For warriors, it is shield block, adding a 75% chance to block the next single incoming attack (two with imp shield block). This certainly pushes you over 100%. However, you have a 5 second cooldown on the ability, which depending on the attack speed of the mob, can still allow crushing blows to get through. But hopefully you can manage it well enough that the occasional crush can be recovered from by the efforts of healers. But, if you fail to keep shield block up or the attack speed of the mob is too fast, two or three crushing blows from a boss can even take out a well geared warrior.
For paladins, it is holy shield, adding a 30% chance to block (35% with the Libram of Repentance) up to 4 hits (8 hits with imp holy shield) for 10 seconds. Paladins also have a random proc'ing talent called redoubt that can add an additional 30% block for 5 hits or 10 seconds. This makes paladins excellent tanks for fast hitting mobs. As a side note, holy shield is also a threat mechanic for paladins, so while gearing up to have great dodge and parry are good, you want to be careful to not make blocks less relevant. Paladins want blocks to happen, so gearing up to make them happen is the best way to go. But don't avoid dodge or parry to hold out for more block! When making gear decisions, just always defer to block aiding items while keeping your current dodge+parry+block value the same or better. In other words, don't drop 5% of dodge to gain 1% of block (exaggerated example )
For druids, it's a bit of a different mechanic. It is actually all about taking crushing blows and surviving them. High armor for mitigation and high stamina to give healers a chance to recover the druid from crushes. Though, it must be said that a druid can do well to increase dodge to help push the chance of a crush further away. For those who are not familiar with druids, in bear form they have and always will have a 0% chance to parry or block and thus their dodge % is the only factor that can make the chance of a crush not happen.
So, if you are tanking encounters and you want them to go well on your side, understand what you can do to aid the group to defeat the encounter. Crushing blows are designed to be the tanks enemy, they are an element of a fight that you are looking to manage as well as maintaining the mobs attention. Sometimes you may hear the term "uncrushable", which is certainly something you can achieve, but it is a spikey state to be in (it comes and goes) and it is something you have to actively work to achieve during a fight. To be "uncrushable" is not a passive undertaking. Until Blizzard makes it possible to have 100% damage avoidance via dodge and parry, the crush will always be something you have to contend with via your active blocking abilities.
If you know a tank, point them to this thread. Even the best healers find it near impossible to recover the tank from excessive crushing blows.
Well, that is it. I hope this helps some to understand what to gear for and also how to handle encounters. If you have any questions, or want to correct anything I wrote, feel free to do so
I thought it would be a good idea to post a reference for us in The Forgiven on how melee damage is handled in the game for those who should be most accustomed to it, mainly tank classes. This thread was sparked by a question we had in Karazhan while fighting maiden:
"What is a crushing blow?"
While it would be simple to focus on just that question, I think if not placed in context with all the other factors, the importance of what it is can be lost. Also, those who like to research info can find this info out, but there are others who may not want to dig around the WoW forums and the internet to fit the pieces together to understand their tanking class better. So this is a thread for The Forgiven to discuss such technical things, because in the end it helps reduce frustration when dealing with content that is not so forgiving
Lets first take a look at what happens on each melee swing. This is the sequence that a melee swing is evaluated against -
Does the swing miss? If not then ...
Does the swing get dodged? If not then ...
Does the swing get parried? If not then ...
Does the swing get blocked? If not then ...
Does the swing critically hit? If not then ...
Does the swing crush? If not then ...
The swing becomes a normal hit.
So we have the following sequence to consider for each melee swing and what it means to the one being hit -
Miss - 100% damage avoidance
Dodge - 100% damage avoidance
Parry - 100% damage avoidance
Block - 100% damage minus damage mitigated by shield block value, shield block rating, strength, armor value, buff and debuffs.
Critical Hit - 200% damage minus passive mitigation (armor value, buffs/debuffs affecting damage taken, etc)
Crushing Hit - 150% damage minus passive mitigation (armor value, buffs/debuffs affecting damage taken, etc)
* Important to know: a crush can only occur if the mob hitting you is 3 or more level above your level.
Normal Hit - 100% damage minus passive mitigation (armor value, buffs/debuffs affecting damage taken, etc)
So why focus on crushes? They are not as bad as criticals, what's the big deal?
Tank classes have 100% control on if they get critically hit or not through gear. Crushing blows, however, can only be 100% avoided by closing the level gap. And in most content, particularly "end game" where the content is on par of the level cap, closing the level gap does not become an option.
However, there is a way to become "uncrushable" (except for druids) through some gearing factors and how the tank actively manages the encounter. The way to do this is to get it so your Dodge, Parry and Block percentages have over a 100% chance to mitigate the incoming hit. This is figured out by simply adding the percentages together.
So, as a tank, if you have the following
Dodge - 20%
Parry - 15%
Block - 15%
You have a 50% chance to avoid a crushing blow. Considering that against bosses that are ?? level (meaning that for the level of the content, they are most certainly more than 3 levels above you) you only have a 50/50 chance of avoiding a chance at a crush (remember, for most tanks, gear and talents push being crit off the table).
So, for warriors and paladins during a fight, you have active abilities that can possibly push crushes off the table and make you "uncrushable" in a way like how defense rating can make you "uncritable".
For warriors, it is shield block, adding a 75% chance to block the next single incoming attack (two with imp shield block). This certainly pushes you over 100%. However, you have a 5 second cooldown on the ability, which depending on the attack speed of the mob, can still allow crushing blows to get through. But hopefully you can manage it well enough that the occasional crush can be recovered from by the efforts of healers. But, if you fail to keep shield block up or the attack speed of the mob is too fast, two or three crushing blows from a boss can even take out a well geared warrior.
For paladins, it is holy shield, adding a 30% chance to block (35% with the Libram of Repentance) up to 4 hits (8 hits with imp holy shield) for 10 seconds. Paladins also have a random proc'ing talent called redoubt that can add an additional 30% block for 5 hits or 10 seconds. This makes paladins excellent tanks for fast hitting mobs. As a side note, holy shield is also a threat mechanic for paladins, so while gearing up to have great dodge and parry are good, you want to be careful to not make blocks less relevant. Paladins want blocks to happen, so gearing up to make them happen is the best way to go. But don't avoid dodge or parry to hold out for more block! When making gear decisions, just always defer to block aiding items while keeping your current dodge+parry+block value the same or better. In other words, don't drop 5% of dodge to gain 1% of block (exaggerated example
)For druids, it's a bit of a different mechanic. It is actually all about taking crushing blows and surviving them. High armor for mitigation and high stamina to give healers a chance to recover the druid from crushes. Though, it must be said that a druid can do well to increase dodge to help push the chance of a crush further away. For those who are not familiar with druids, in bear form they have and always will have a 0% chance to parry or block and thus their dodge % is the only factor that can make the chance of a crush not happen.
So, if you are tanking encounters and you want them to go well on your side, understand what you can do to aid the group to defeat the encounter. Crushing blows are designed to be the tanks enemy, they are an element of a fight that you are looking to manage as well as maintaining the mobs attention. Sometimes you may hear the term "uncrushable", which is certainly something you can achieve, but it is a spikey state to be in (it comes and goes) and it is something you have to actively work to achieve during a fight. To be "uncrushable" is not a passive undertaking. Until Blizzard makes it possible to have 100% damage avoidance via dodge and parry, the crush will always be something you have to contend with via your active blocking abilities.
If you know a tank, point them to this thread. Even the best healers find it near impossible to recover the tank from excessive crushing blows.
Well, that is it. I hope this helps some to understand what to gear for and also how to handle encounters. If you have any questions, or want to correct anything I wrote, feel free to do so
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