Born Again

But apparently every opinion in RD has to be backed up by the Word of God.

Firstly, not every opinion in RD is backed up by God's Word; in fact, many opinions expressed by a variety of folks are a polar opposite of what God's Word says.

However, as a Christian, what higher authority exists on which you base your opinions, if not God's word? That question is not rhetorical-- if you can answer it, I'd like to hear your answer.
 

Jeshurun

New Member
[toj.cc]WildBillKickoff;184979 said:
Firstly, not every opinion in RD is backed up by God's Word; in fact, many opinions expressed by a variety of folks are a polar opposite of what God's Word says.

However, as a Christian, what higher authority exists on which you base your opinions, if not God's word? That question is not rhetorical-- if you can answer it, I'd like to hear your answer.

Bill I never said that every opinion was backed up by the Word Of God in here and you seem to misunderstand my point and that is if one expresses his opinion even though he knows in his heart it to be true through what he has read in God's word and if he does not back up his opinion with the Word of God then that person is attacked personally sometimes and if not that then he is made to feel frowned upon for his opinion. This is the reason why I said "but apparently every opinion in RD has to be backed up by the Word of God".


I would have say that your doing the latter of my statement above just by what you are doing right now by commenting with your question that is off topic about something I was speaking to Ash about personally.

My answer to your query though is that my opinion was and always is based on the truth of God's Holy Word.

There are those I'm sure who would think otherwise but then thats their opinion Bill.:)

P.S. If you would care to discuss this further I think it would be best to go to thread by Priceless3110 called Christian Forums in General. I have already made the similiar statement in there. Good Day to You.
 
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Jeshurun

New Member
Now as to staying on topic here goes...:D

Now if I may continue my opinion Ash as to what I was trying to convey which is based on the Word of God/the bible.:)

The statements made by Jesus in John 6:53-58 precludes a direct reference to the Lord's Supper and He is not teaching here that recieving that sacrament is the one requirement for eternal life or that it is the thing through which His saving benefits are accepted.
Looking back at John 6:35,40,47,51 flesh and blood are pointing back to Christ as the one crucified and the only way to have life.
Jesus is talking more on faith here, the faith to accept Him as the one God sent as a sacrifice.
The Lord's Supper is similiar to what I had said previously about baptism in that an outward ritual does not neccessarily bring about any inward work.
However I'm not saying that it can't either, I'm trying to make a point here that baptism is not of any ritual requirement - at least not directly anyway.

Now as for washing/drinking John 4:13 Jesus here is talking about himself as being a fountain of Living water and since He is the Word made flesh He speaking of drinking in the Word, Himself, the Word of God.
How does one stay alive without water?
In the same way we who have been born again we as Christians need to stay alive in Christ through the drinking/reading, hearing of the word of God.
Just like a plant who needs water to grow and survive we to as Christians need to continue to drink in the Water of Life, Jesus Christ, the Word of God.

Now as for washing in the Word Jesus also said in John 7:37,38 that streams of living water flow from within the one who drinks of Him and by that it means that the Holy Spirit who would wash you in the Word.

When Moses and the Israelites passed through the sea it was a symbol of baptism. 1 Cor.10:1-4 speaks about this , "that they all ate the same spiritual food and drank the same spiritual drink", they drank from the spiritual rock and that Rock was God, the Word of God, Jesus Christ.

1 Cor.12:13 talks about that we as Christians are baptized by one Spirit into one body and that we are given the one Spirit to drink. We become regenerated by the Holy Spirit.
Why you may say - so that our lives would overflow/be washed by the fruit of the Spirit [Gal.5:22-23; and remember what Jesus said in John 7:37-39 about streams of living water flowing from within].

And now it is fitting that I should finish up here with this scripture from Rev.21:6 He said to me:"It is done. I am the Alfa and Omega, the Beginning and the End. To him who is thirsty I will give to drink without cost from the spring of the water of life."


[Re-edited the question below on Oct.5/06 to make the answer I gave below it more clear.]
How does one go about overcoming the world in ones self and eventually becoming mature and strong in Christ after being born again?

By being saturated in the washing of the Word of God by the Holy Spirit and us drinking in the written Word of God by reading/hearing and mediatating on it day and night.
 
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Zeena

New Member
Nothing is needed to be born again into the image of Jesus, except Jesus..
No bible, no preaching, no people, no powers.. Nothing, except Jesus :)

To say we need to read our bibles would be legalism, for we need..Jesus
 

Zeena

New Member
Not sure what you mean Zeena? Would you mind elaborating further?
I dun know how I can.. I made it as simple as I possible could..Hrmm..

OK!

Jesus is the Living God, ergo He comes to those who are living to reveal Himself as the Life. That is to say, the only REAL Life!

He says His word (living word) has gone into ALL the world so that men are without excuse.

Being born again is recieving the Life of Jesus, because of His Witness to us that we are incapable of living up to God's Holy Law in and of ourselves.. It's His promise to us that He has Lived up to the Holy Requirements of the Holy God, who judges all men.. Jesus was judged because He accepted me, in Himself, on the cross. My old self was crucified with Him, so that I might Live in NEWNESS of Life..His LIFE, the One He gave me when He ascended on High and lead me to Heaven. The New Life He gave me by His Holy Spirit, wherefor I know I am a child of God, because that New Life cries out to God as His Child "Abba, Father!"

Romans 8:13-15
For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God. For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

None of this is by reading, or studying, or living up to God's Holy Law..
But it is a FREE gift from Jesus to us!
Even His Life!

Legalism would be putting all sorts of (err, ANY) conditions on the above..
God did it ALL!
He gave His Righteousness, His Faith, His Heart, His Spirit, His Soul, His body, His BEING to us as a free gift to any who would recieve it!

John 1:12-13
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
I pray God will make this plain to your conscience as well :)
 

Jeshurun

New Member
Let me ask you somethings Zeena.

Now that you have Christ residing in your heart are you saying that you feel that you no longer need to seek what is right and true in the Word of God in order for you to grow strong in the Lord?

Tell me this do you have all the Word of God memorized in your heart yet?

If you had no more access to the Word of God/the Bible ever again tell me how would you produce any kind of fruit without the Truth of God's Word residing in your heart?

If we do not seek how will we find and if we do not know the promises of God's Word through diligently seeking after the Truth of God's Word how do we grow and become mature in Christ?

The Holy Spirit can only do so much and even through prayer it is not enough we must seek and be diligent with a hunger for the Word that only God can give so that we get to know His charactor and become like Him through the reading and hearing of His Holy Word.

Seeking the Truth in God's Holy Word is hardly legalistic and you say its not a condition for one to seek first the kingdom of God, but it is if you are to be a strong mature Christian eventually.
Yes God did everthing for us so that we would be reconciled unto Him but without the Bible, the Word of God how are we to know Him if we do not seek Him and find Him.

The Holy Spirit helps me to understand the Truth of his Word, the Bible.

The new life I have now is because of the blood of Jesus Christ and my faith is in His blood for His blood is upon me, and praise God there is life in the blood, life eternal through the precious blood of Jesus Christ.

Deuteronomy 4:29 But from there you will seek the Lord your God, and you will find Him, if you search after Him with all your heart and with all your soul.

Matt. 7:8 Jesus said "he who seeks finds".

2 Peter 3:18 But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

As one is who a part of the body of Christ how can I grow without the rest of the body as well to help me in the Way of the Lord for in fellowship we grow together and also, even though I'm rooted in Christ I still need the living water of God's Word to grow strong in Him.

So I say read the Word of God, the Holy Bible and seek Him, study it and go to church and hear His Word read outloud by the Pastor, memorize it and call on the Holy Spirit to remind you of it, meditate on it so that you will grow up in His knowledge and eventually become a mature strong Christian.
 
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aka Ash

New Member
*note*Thank you Jesh for explaining why you said/believe what you said. I can at least understand your beliefs. *end note*

Zeena said:
To say we need to read our bibles would be legalism, for we need..Jesus

The bible = the word of God.
Therefore the bible is a way for God to communicate to us.
Hence reading the bible is communication with God. We ask, he answers.
We need to communicate with God, to try to work towards Perfection.

We can't, I will stress CAN'T, accept Jesus as savior, and then put God on a shelf, ignore him, sin until we die, act however we want and just blow God off. There is no scripture that backs that up...None.

Your logic states that we don't need to pray either. Doing anything actually would be construed as legalism.

Jeshurun said:
So I say read the Word of God, the Holy Bible and seek Him, study it and go to church and hear His Word read outloud by the Pastor, memorize it and call on the Holy Spirit to remind you of it, meditate on it so that you will grow up in His knowledge and eventually become a mature strong Christian.
Exactly, well said Jesh.
 

Zeena

New Member
Let me answer your questions with some of my own.. Hrmm?

How did Paul write the espistles?
On the Isle of Patmos, did John not have the word of God indwelling him, witnessing to him, empowering him and filling him in every way to write down what God had revealed to him for us?

Let's change pace a little shall we?

Does God Live?
Is He Living in you?
Is HE the Word of God, sent to us?

Is He the Author of our Faith?
IS He also not the perfector of such?

John 5:39
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
But I have a better hope for YOU Jeshurun :)
Acts 17:10-12
11These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

No, I do not need the bible, for Jesus is the Living word..
But, seeing as HE has given it to me, aught I not to partake?
To make my hope sure?
 

Jeshurun

New Member
No, I do not need the bible, for Jesus is the Living word..
But, seeing as HE has given it to me, aught I not to partake?
To make my hope sure?



Have you ever heard or read this from Proverbs 16:18?

Please becareful.
 
Jeshurun said:
My answer to your query though is that my opinion was and always is based on the truth of God's Holy Word.

There are those I'm sure who would think otherwise but then thats their opinion Bill.:)

P.S. If you would care to discuss this further I think it would be best to go to thread by Priceless3110 called Christian Forums in General. I have already made the similiar statement in there. Good Day to You.
No offense meant Jesh. Sarcasm is notoriously difficult to convey through text, and I missed yours. No need to discuss this further, I'm open to any opinion that can be backed by Scripture, even if it's something I disagree with personally.
 
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